Great Circle Distance Derivation

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the derivation of the Great Circle Distance on a spherical surface, exploring both the mathematical formulation and the integration of differential elements to confirm the distance formula. Participants engage with the definitions and relationships involved in spherical coordinates and the implications of integrating over a curved surface.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant presents a derivation of the Great Circle Distance using spherical coordinates and the dot product of position vectors, leading to the formula S = R cos-1 [ sinθ1 sinθ2 + cosθ1 cosθ2 cos(φ2-φ1) ].
  • Another participant suggests that to confirm the formula, one should integrate the expression (ds)² = R² [ (dθ)² + sin²θ (dφ)² ] along the shortest curve, but notes that the relationship between θ and φ along this curve is complicated.
  • A participant expresses a desire to validate the formula (ds)² = R² [ (dθ)² + sin²θ (dφ)² ] through integration.
  • Another participant proposes considering two points with a small angle εα between them and suggests letting ε approach zero as a method to explore the integration further.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the integration approach or the necessity of confirming the formula through this method. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the best way to validate the distance formula.

Contextual Notes

The discussion highlights the complexity of integrating over a curved surface and the dependence on the relationship between spherical coordinates. There are unresolved aspects regarding the integration process and the assumptions involved in the derivation.

IWantToLearn
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I derived the shortest distance between two points on a spherical surface (Great Circle Distance) , using the definition of the spherical coordinates and the dot product of the position vectors r1 and r2 where
r1 = ( R cosθ1 cosφ1 , R cosθ1 sinφ1 , R sinθ1 )
r2 = ( R cosθ2 cosφ2 , R cosθ2 sinφ2 , R sinθ2 )
α = cos-1 [ (r1r2)/(r1r2) ]

And the great circle distance S = α R

to find that S = R cos-1 [ sinθ1 sinθ2 + cosθ1 cosθ2 cos(φ21) ]

however i know that the square of the distance between two points that are very close to each other on a spherical surface is : (ds)2 = R2 [ (dθ)2 + sin2θ (dφ)2 ]

As far as i understand this should be integrated to to find S between any two points on the surface , and it should yield the same formula above

I need to know how to do this
 
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IWantToLearn said:
As far as i understand this should be integrated to to find S between any two points on the surface , and it should yield the same formula above
If you integrate it along the shortest curve, that works, but the θ,φ relation along that shortest curve is complicated. Why do you want to do that?
 
mfb said:
If you integrate it along the shortest curve, that works, but the θ,φ relation along that shortest curve is complicated. Why do you want to do that?

I want to convince myself that this formula (ds)2= R2 [ (dθ)2 + sin2θ (dφ)2 ] is true
 
Then you can consider two points with an angle ##\epsilon \alpha## between them, and let ##\epsilon## go to zero.
 

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