Growth of Functions - Big Theta

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the properties of Big Theta notation in relation to the growth of functions, specifically whether the relationship is symmetric: if \( f(x) \) is Big Theta of \( g(x) \), does it necessarily follow that \( g(x) \) is Big Theta of \( f(x) \)? The scope includes theoretical aspects and definitions related to asymptotic notation.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants assert that if \( f(x) = \Theta(g(x)) \), then it must also be true that \( g(x) = \Theta(f(x)) \).
  • One participant explains that the definition of \( f(x) = \Theta(g(x)) \) implies certain bounds that suggest symmetry, provided \( f(x) \) and \( g(x) \) are nonnegative.
  • Another participant raises a concern about the validity of the double inequality when considering negative values for \( f(x) \) and positive values for \( g(x) \), questioning the implications of such cases.
  • A participant notes that the definition of \( \Theta \) in some contexts does not involve absolute values, which could affect the symmetry of the relationship.
  • One participant admits confusion between Big O and Big Theta, indicating a misunderstanding of their equivalence.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the symmetry of the Big Theta relationship, with some supporting it under certain conditions while others highlight exceptions, particularly when negative values are involved. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the implications of these definitions.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include the dependence on definitions of Big Theta that may vary, particularly concerning the treatment of negative values and the context in which the notation is applied (e.g., algorithm analysis versus general mathematical functions).

Lepros
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If f(x) if big-theta of g(x), is it also always the case then that g(x) is big-theta of f(x)?
 
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Affirmative. (The forum requires a 5-character minimum reply, so I could not just answer "yes".)
 
Evgeny.Makarov said:
Affirmative. (The forum requires a 5-character minimum reply, so I could not just answer "yes".)

Changed to 3. Now you can write "No." or "Yes."
 
Evgeny.Makarov said:
Affirmative. (The forum requires a 5-character minimum reply, so I could not just answer "yes".)
Why ?
 
Well, $f(x)=\Theta(g(x))$ means that from some $x_0$ forward and for some positive constants $C_1$ and $C_2$ we have $C_1g(x)\le f(x)\le C_2g(x)$. From this it is clear that $g(x)$ can be similarly bounded by $f(x)$, at least when $f(x)$ and $g(x)$ are (eventually) nonnegative.
 
But how can you write the double inequality ? We know it's okay if we consider absolute values, but if for example $\forall x>x_0~,~f(x)<0~\text{and}~g(x)>0,~\text{while}~C|f(x)|>g(x)$, what would happen ?

Another equivalent definition (or almost) is that limsup |f/g| < infinity, but if it's 0, couldn't there be a problem ?

I'm basing all this on the wikipedia, so please excuse my ignorance :DThis document ( http://courses.cs.vt.edu/~cs2604/Summer2000/Notes/C03.Asymptotics.pdf ) covers quite a lot of properties related to the big theta. But none of them talk about the equivalence...
 
Last edited:
In the Wikipedia page about Big O notation, the definition of $\Theta$ does not involve absolute values, so the relation $f(x)=\Theta(g(x))$ is symmetric. In the PDF document you provided, $\Theta$ is defined only for nonnegative functions. In my experience, $\Theta$ is most often used in algorithm analysis, where resources are usually nonnegative.

For functions that can be negative, the answer depends on the details of the definition of $\Theta$. If it means $C_1|g(x)|\le |f(x)|\le C_2|g(x)|$, then again the relation is symmetric. If it means $C_1g(x)\le |f(x)|\le C_2g(x)$, then, as you say, it does not follow that $|g(x)|\le 1/C_1\cdot f(x)$.
 
Evgeny.Makarov said:
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Sorry, I was considering big O and not big theta :( I thought there were the same :(
 

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