Handling Random Uncertainties: Best Practices for Niles

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    Random Uncertainties
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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the handling of random uncertainties in measurements, particularly the justification for using Gaussian distributions to model these uncertainties. Participants explore theoretical aspects, including the Central Limit Theorem (CLT) and its implications for measured variables, as well as specific modeling approaches related to location problems.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants note that the CLT suggests that the sum of many random variables approaches a Gaussian distribution, but question how this applies to the measured variable itself.
  • One participant proposes that the effects of uncertainties are additive, which relates to the CLT.
  • Another participant argues that while errors may be Gaussian, this does not necessarily imply that the measured variable is Gaussian.
  • A model is presented where the variable is expressed as the mean value plus random error, suggesting that if the random error is Gaussian, then the variable is also Gaussian.
  • There is a clarification that a "location problem" refers to determining the mean value of a variable, which is a measure of center.
  • Participants discuss the interchangeability of "error" and "uncertainty" in the context of modeling, questioning if the model holds for location problems.
  • A more general approach is introduced, where the variable is modeled as a deterministic expression plus a random error component.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the relationship between Gaussian distributions and measured variables, indicating that the discussion remains unresolved regarding the justification for using Gaussian approximations in specific contexts.

Contextual Notes

Participants acknowledge that the discussion involves assumptions about the nature of uncertainties and the definitions of terms like "error" and "uncertainty," which may not be universally agreed upon.

Niles
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Hi

In http://sl-proj-bi-specification.web.cern.ch/sl-proj-bi-specification/Activities/Glossary/techglos.pdf it says that: ... if the sources of uncertainties are numerous, the Gaussian distribution is generally a good approximation.

I don't quite understand why. The Central Limit Theorem (CLT) only says that if we have a sum S of N random variables, then S will be Gaussian for very large N. So the CLT does not explain the above. In that case, where does the statement come from?Niles.
 
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The general interpretation is that the effects of those uncertainties are additive - that's where the CLT comes in.
 
But that would only explain why the errors are Gaussian, not why the measured variable is Gaussian.
 
If the problem is a location problem, the "model" can be described as

Variable = Mean value + Random error

with "Mean value" a constant. Since the random error is Gaussian, so is the variable.
 
statdad said:
If the problem is a location problem, the "model" can be described as ...

I am not sure I understand what you mean by "location problem". In my case we are talking about measured speeds.
 
A "location problem" simply means you are trying to determine the mean value of a variable. A mean is one type of measure of location, or measure of center.

I don't know exactly what type of problem you're involved in: my posts above were

1) to show how the Gaussian distribution arises from the "many sources of uncertainty"
2) to show one way in which a measured random quantity can be assumed to have a gaussian distribution
 
Ok, I understand. In post #2 and #4 you use "error" and "uncertainty" interchangeably. Does

Variable = Mean value + Uncertainty

also hold for a location problem?Niles.
 
I guess - the main idea is that the variable is a constant value + some unmeasurable random behavior, which is often modeled by a normal (Gaussian) distribution.

An approach slightly more general than the location model is given by

Variable = Model + Error

where ``Model'' is some deterministic (non-random) expression. Consider multiple regression:

[tex] Y = \underbrace{\beta_0 + \beta_1 x_1 + \dots + \beta_p x_p}_{\text{Model}} + \varepsilon[/tex]

with [itex]\varepsilon[/itex] is the random error component
 
Last edited:
Thanks, it was very kind of you.

Best wishes,
Niles.
 

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