Exploring Mach's Principle: From Newton's Bucket to Quantum Gravity

  • Thread starter einstein_vishnu
  • Start date
  • Tags
    Principle
In summary, there is still ongoing debate about the extent to which general relativity conforms to Mach's Principle. While Einstein initially intended for his theory to fully implement Mach's program, it has been argued that it only partially integrates the principle. Some physicists do not consider Mach's principle to be crucial for general relativity, while others believe it can shed light on issues such as the origin of inertia. The original
  • #1
einstein_vishnu
please,any one could help in in illustrating the mach's principle.I want to know on what basis he has arrived at the conclusion.some best articles that u suggest to gothrough...
does einstein's theory include the principle or not?i think it has got the place in gr.
 
Physics news on Phys.org
  • #2
Einstein vs. Bohr by Dr. Mendel Sachs
The Science of Mechanics by Ernst Mach
http://www.padrak.com/ine/INERTIA.html
http://www.compukol.com/mendel/articles/The_Mach_Principle.pdf [Broken]
http://www.encyclopedia.com/html/M/Machspri.asp [Broken]

2.4 "Mach's Principle"
To be sure, for a number of years Einstein expressed the ambition of the general theory of relativity to fully implement Mach's program for the relativization of all inertial effects, even appending the so-called "cosmological constant" to his field equations (1917b) for this purpose. This real point of contact of Mach's influence was clearly identified only in 1918, when Einstein distinguished what he baptized as "Mach's Principle" (roughly, that inertial effects stem from an interaction of bodies) from the principle of general relativity which he now interpreted as the principle of general covariance. Taken together with the principle of the equivalence, Einstein asserted that the three principles, were three "points of view" on which his theory rested, even if they could not be thought completely independent of one another. Despite Einstein's intent, there is considerable disagreement about the extent to which, if at all, general relativity conforms to "Mach's Principle". In part this is due to vagaries regarding what the Principle actually asserts and then again, to difficulties in comprehending what physical mechanism might implement the Principle, however interpreted. How, for instance, could a body's inertial mass be accounted due to the influence of all other bodies in the universe? (See the discussions in Barbour and Pfister (1995)).
SOURCE: http//plato.stanford.edu/entries/genrel-early/URCE:

http://scienceworld.wolfram.com/physics/MachsPrinciple.html
 
Last edited by a moderator:
  • #3
Mach's conjecture is still an open problem,it was not disproved yet.However,in spite of Einstein's intentions,nowadays physicists do not consider it (Mach's principle) as crucial for General Relativity;indeed DeSitter found solutions of Einstein's equations characterising expanding universes even in the total absence of matter.Thus it is accepted the minimum interpretation,the principle of equivalence could represent only a partial integration of Mach's principle into GR.This interpretation is evident even in the usual approaches of classical problems,for example if we were to accept Mach's principle (as Mach put it) then we should treat centrifugal forces as being real forces or in all mainstream treatises it is specifically underlined the fact that they are imaginary.
 
Last edited:
  • #4
Mach thought that the inertia of a local mass was caused by all the other masses
in the universe.If there are a finite number of Higgs particles in the universe to cause mass, isn't this true? If I could remove a galaxy from the universe then the higgs particles associated with its atoms would be redistributed among the remaining atoms of the universe and they would presumably all have a slightly higher mass than before.
 
  • #5
I recall reading Einstein said that Mach's principle in its' original form had been very helpfull in early days of GR development.During the years he admited he changed his mind about interpretation of the principle (ie the meaning of it).
Still open problem,I agree.
 
  • #6
The principle was to address the problem of centrifugal force, which had managed to preserve some vestige of the notion of absolute space which remains inescapable in most classical mechanical treatements that are not specifically taylored to eliminate it.

You can look into some of the writings of Bishop Berkeley for a related perspective.

You can find a treatement of Mach's principle in the translated work of Einstein, The Meaning of Relativity. The weak, low velocity approximation is used. A material particle is indirectly demonstrated to experience a centrifugal and coriolis force by virtue of the motion of the source body.
 
  • #7
turin said:
look into some of the writings of Bishop Berkeley for a related perspective.
turin,
Would you be kind and be more specific regarding Bishop Berkeley's writings you are reffering to?I didn't read it.Publisher,title?

TeV
 
  • #8
TeV said:
Would you be kind and be more specific regarding Bishop Berkeley's writings you are reffering to?I didn't read it.Publisher,title?
This is going to sound terribly uncongenial, but no. I remember reading some stuff in passing, but I didn't write it down, and I don't have time to go track it down. I did a quick search on the web just before I posted that last post of mine in order to see if I could pin down a specific citation or source, but to no avail. You can consider the name as a tenuous lead, and follow it if you are truly interested.

Just so we're clear and you don't get surprised though, Mr. Berkeley was a straight-up philosopher, not a physicist. It wasn't so much what he said; it was the clarity with which he exposed a long-time concern of mine that I could never seem capable of communicating. Frankly, he may be quite bogus, but I happen to agree with the little that I have read.
 
  • #9
Consider going to Amazon and doing a search on Julian Barbour. I have a copy of his _Mach's Principle: From Newton's Bucket to Quantum Gravity (Einstein Studies, Vol 6)_
which is out of print but might be availalbe at university libraries, and have pre-ordered _Absolute or Relative Motion: The Deep Structure of General Relativity_ which he has been promising for years now... He alludes to some of the ideas he will present in his _The End of Time: The Next Revolution in Physics_ and claims a deep connection between GR and Mach's principle beyond what even Einstein held, then backed away from.

(I on the other hand do not think Mach's principle is correct, and inertia can be explained as a local phenomina related to mass. But this is purely a personal view, and a side issue of my own research.)
 

What is Mach's Principle?

Mach's Principle is a scientific theory proposed by physicist Ernst Mach in the late 19th century. It suggests that the inertia (or resistance to change in motion) of an object is influenced by the distribution of matter in the universe.

How does Mach's Principle relate to the concept of relativity?

Mach's Principle is closely linked to Einstein's theory of general relativity. In fact, Einstein was inspired by Mach's ideas when developing his theory. Mach's Principle helps to explain the behavior of objects in a non-inertial reference frame, such as those experiencing acceleration or rotation.

What evidence supports Mach's Principle?

There is still much debate among scientists about the validity of Mach's Principle. Some argue that it is difficult to test and therefore lacks empirical evidence. However, some observations, such as the rotation of galaxies, could potentially be explained by Mach's Principle.

How does Mach's Principle impact our understanding of the universe?

Mach's Principle challenges our traditional understanding of the relationship between matter and motion. It suggests that the behavior of objects is not solely determined by their own properties, but rather by the entire distribution of matter in the universe. This concept has implications for our understanding of gravity, inertia, and the structure of the universe.

Are there any criticisms of Mach's Principle?

As with any scientific theory, there are criticisms and limitations to Mach's Principle. Some argue that it is too vague and difficult to test, while others propose alternative theories to explain the same phenomena. Additionally, Mach's Principle has not been fully incorporated into mainstream physics and is still considered a controversial idea.

Similar threads

  • Special and General Relativity
2
Replies
36
Views
2K
  • Special and General Relativity
2
Replies
50
Views
2K
  • Special and General Relativity
Replies
32
Views
5K
  • Cosmology
2
Replies
67
Views
8K
  • Special and General Relativity
Replies
16
Views
2K
  • Special and General Relativity
Replies
5
Views
1K
  • Special and General Relativity
Replies
1
Views
951
  • Special and General Relativity
Replies
4
Views
1K
  • Beyond the Standard Models
3
Replies
71
Views
5K
  • STEM Academic Advising
Replies
1
Views
503
Back
Top