Help! Need Advice for Statistics Exam Disaster

[Cyrus]

I need your help someone! I have a VERY serious problem...


I was supposed to take my statistics exam today at 8am. But my teacher said in class that we could take the exam on tuesday if we were in the electronics class, which has the exam on the same day, (today, saturday).

He sent out this email on thursday

This was the time stamp: Thu, 11 May 2006 15:55:22 -0400

The final is 8AM on this Saturday.

The makeup final for people who cannot take the final on saturday - due to religious reasons or the Electronics exam - is on Tuesday 5/16 from 2-4 pm in the Mech Eng conf room 2164.

If you are taking the exam on Tuesday, please send me in your name by 4pm tomorrow - no exceptions.

(On the other hand if you send in your name to take it on tuesday and wake up on Saturday morning and want to take the exam, you can. What you cannot do is wake up and email me that you cannot take the exam and will take it on Tuesday. That dog don't hunt!)

Good luck.

drb and James

Ok, so I send him this email thursday night at 12:00 p.m. knowing that it would get to his inbox and he could reply first thing in the morning tomorrow.

Hi,

I am going to take the make up exam on tuesday,

Cyrus

Ok, so friday comes along. I wait......I wait......I wait....NO RESPONSE. I am like this guy should have responded by now. He should have checked his email early in the morining and gave me a thumbs up or thumbs down.

So I take my electronics exam today (saturday) and my friend tells me, oh by the way did you get professor b's email? I'm like no, what email? Oh, he sent out an email for the exam. I said, well, I already sent him an email asking to take the makeup, and I did not think twice about it.


Take the electronics exam, bomb it, come home and check my email. Look what I find. (3) emails in my inbox from friday NIGHT. LOOK AT THE TIMESTAMP!

Fri, 12 May 2006 19:50:45 -0400

My offer for people to take the test on Tuesday was for one of two reasons - religious reasons or you have another exam right after this on Saturday - was that electronics.

For ALL of you who sent me emails saying that you would "like to take the test" on Tuesday, or that you are informing me that you are or any of those things please note:

SEND ME ANOTHER EMAIL SAYING THAT YOU HAVE ANOTHER FINAL ON SATURDAY IN A SPECIFIC COURSE AND WHICH COURSE AND WHICH TIME FOR THE FINAL OR ITS A RELIGIOUS REASON.

IF IT IS NOT THOSE REASONS ---YOU ARE TAKING THE FINAL ON SATURDAY. IF YOU SHOW UP TUESDAY THINKING I SAID YES TO THE REASON YOU MADE UP THEN YOU WILL NOT SIT FOR THE FINAL.

Then he sends this one:

12 May 2006 19:56:07 -0400

On May 12 2006, Cyrus wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I am going to take the make up exam on tuesday,
>
> Cyrus
>

please see email i sent to class i do not accept this email

drb

And then he sends this email:

Fri, 12 May 2006 20:16:42 -0400

I had received 18 requests to take the final on Tuesday. So far I have accepted 9 of them -chalmers, colfack, Tapp, Shilling, Stein,Piel, Minovich and Cushing. These nine included the reason.

The rest I have not yet accepted and unless i do i expect you to take the test on saturday. Unless i receive an acceptable email back.


(I will be on email for a while longer tonite dr. b)

HE SENT THIS THE DAY BEFORE THE EXAM AT 8:00 PM AND WANTED A REPLY BEFORE 12!?!?

So when I got home and opened my email today, I nearly took a S*** in my pants; because, in effect, I now have a ZERO on my final exam and I will have an end grade of 71%, w/o the final grade. I had a 93% in the class w/o including the final exam grade.

I EVEN WENT TO HIS OFFICE ON THURSDAY EVENING AND ASKED HIM IN PERSON TO TAKE THE EXAM TUESDAY! I specifically TOLD him, is it possible to take the test earlier if I feel ready, even though I should take it thursday. He said sure that's fine. I AM THE REASON HE SENT OUT THAT FIRST EMAIL!

I AM ABOUT TO EITHER (1) KILL SOMEBODY or (2) PASS OUT


GODDDDDDDDDD DAMMMMMMMMMMMMMNIT I AM ANGRY!

If he says no to taking the exam, I am going to go to the Dean, but I know that it will be out of the Dean's hands...

F******************************K!

You're a teacher moonbear, I need your advice on what to do if he says no.

 

[Pyrrhus]

Wow, sorry for that. I guess it's definately a bad situation. Anyway, keep your cool. I've been to similar situations, sometimes you win, sometimes you lose...

 

[Gokul43201]

Send him an email explaining the situation, just as you did here (leaving out the expletives, perhaps). You should also remind him that you were the student who met him in his office about this. Also, is there anything you can show him as proof that you had an electronics exam today ? Unless he is totally @n@!, I imagine he'll let you take the exam on tuesday...assuming there's no procedural roadblocks which need clearance from a higher power.

In any case, I would think you should send him the email kinda soon. If there's red tape that needs to be cut, monday is the only day to cut it.

 

[heartless]

I can't quite followed it.

You visited him on Thursday evening, and you say that you're the reason he sent out the first email, but the date on his thursday's email seems to be 15:55 or 3:55p.m afternoon.
It's of no importance to me. I just want to make sure,

Then he sent some another email 2.32 hours ago/today, so you still had 4 hours until 12:00. Isn't that enough to get him a reply?

Cyrus, you still have time. Send him a good, acceptable reason back, and everything is going to be fine. Anyway, If I were him, I also wouldn't accept emails without reasons.

I think, I know what you feel. I had a couple of similar situations, but I tried to explain myself, give reasons, and everything was alright.

From what I see, your professor/teacher looks like a nice guy, so send him a good reason and explanation, and forget about pain and worries.

 

[Curious3141]

Cyrus, your first email to him was not as detailed as it should've been. It is possible he didn't remember your face to face meeting, so just to cover your bases, you should've stated the reason (EE exam Sat) in the first email rather than just saying "hey, I'm taking it Tuesday". I get the feeling he thinks some students are trying to take advantage of his flexibility to get more time to prepare for the exam or try and cheat by asking their friends about the questions that were asked on the Sat exam.

I think there's still time to show your sincerity, go see him again with documentary evidence of sitting for the EE exam on Tuesday (like a timetable) and explain matters. This is just a minor misunderstanding, you still have time, but you must act fast.

 

[Cyrus]

I already sent him an email today, and did what you all said the moment I read his email. I saw his email and said WTF IS THIS!? because I was checking my email until around 7:30, then I figured this guy isint going to respond at all to my request.


This guy's syllabus has the wrong book in it, and says to read the chapters from a book that we are not using, and is dated from last semester. His syllabus has a section on academic integrity that says "The Code of Academic Integrity found in the 1999-99 Undergraduate Catalog will be upheld." MAN WHAT A F***** joke...

This is TOTALLY UNPROFESSIONAL and UNACCEPTABLE

 

[Moonbear]

Send him an email explaining the situation, just as you did here (leaving out the explitives, perhaps). You should also remind him that you were the student who met him in his office about this. Also, is there anything you can show him as proof that you had an electronics exam today ? Unless he is totally @n@!, I imagine he'll let you take the exam on tuesday...assuming there's no procedural roadblocks which need clearance from a higher power.

In any case, I would think you should send him the email kinda soon. If there's red tape that needs to be cut, monday is the only day to cut it.

I agree with this approach. Explain you did not get his email on Friday night...either because you were busy studying for the EE exam, or had already gone to sleep to be rested for the EE exam...whichever is applicable.

As long as you have the first email, and proof you took the EE exam, even if he tries to give you a hard time about it, you'll be able to fight it. No matter what goes on between now and Tuesday, show up Tuesday for the make-up and take it (yes, try to explain your reasoning so it's all smoothed over before then, but even if he tells you it's too late, show up anyway). You can always fight over whether it gets graded or counted after the fact, but make sure you take it. It's not reasonable to give you only 4 hours to reply to an email, especially one sent the night before an exam. If he gives you a hard time over that, tell him he should have a read receipt for the email that will show you didn't even get it until Saturday...and if he doesn't use read receipts, then he has no proof you ever received it. (But be really nice about how you say that!) I know of cases where students appealed for make-up exams for far flimsier reasons and had it hold up.

What does the course syllabus say about make-up exams?

 

[Cyrus]

What does the course syllabus say about make-up exams?

That's a damn good question. I wonder how many YEARS old that policy is in his syllabus?

Make-up examinations will be offered and late homework, late course project assignments, and late class enrichment assignments will be accepted ONLY in the case of excused absences as defined by the University's Attendance Policy. Exceptions may be appropriate for truly exceptional situations.

The underlined part is a link, that does not work... go figure.

 

[Moonbear]

This guy's syllabus has the wrong book in it, and says to read the chapters from a book that we are not using, and is dated from last semester. His syllabus has a section on academic integrity that says "The Code of Academic Integrity found in the 1999-99 Undergraduate Catalog will be upheld." MAN WHAT A F***** joke...

Good news kiddo! If that's all the syllabus says on the matter (well, see if you can get an ancient copy of the catalog with that version of the code, just in case), then his syllabus is far too lacking to hold anything against you. Unless it says something very specifically about NO make-up exams without permission (in which case, until you receive a reply granting permission, you have to assume you're taking the exam at the usual time regardless of whether you sent an email requesting permission), there is nothing that would supercede that email he sent offering make-up exams to anyone taking the EE test. Like I said, show up no matter what and take it. As long as it's taken, you can appeal later if he refuses to grade it.

 

[Moonbear]

The underlined part is a link, that does not work... go figure.

Well, I think a truly exceptional circumstance is the professor telling you that you can take a make-up if you have another exam the same day. Informing you the night before that he has changed the rules of the game is not even reasonable, because there's a world of difference between expecting to study for an exam on Tuesday AFTER you take your Saturday exam vs studying to take both exams on Saturday, especially if you are not told until 8 pm the day before (even if you HAD gotten his email) that the exception no longer applies. Save all the emails. The worst thing that will happen is you'll have to appeal to the dean and go through a bunch of hassle to get the grade counted, but if a student came to me with what you've explained here, I'd side with the student on this one.

 

[Gokul43201]

If the worst happens and he doesn't reply (and you can't find him in school on monday), send him another email that you would still be showing up to take the exam on Tuesday.

If he shows up on tuesday with only 9 copies of the exam paper, he'd better have a good reason for doing that if you've informed him that you intend to show up, no matter what.

Also, do you know if you're the only one not on that list of 9 names that had the EE exam on Saturday ? If there's more of you in the same boat, it'll be harder for him to be harsh.

 

[Cyrus]

This class was a disaster from day 1.

SIGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH...

this is a loose loose situation.

(1) he let's me take the exam and I pass the class (But I did not learn JACK-S in that class, it was TERRIBLE)

(2) I fail with a C, and have to retake it with him AGAIN, because he's the ONLY prof teaching it.

<SMACKING MYSELF IN THE FOREHEAD>

Here is the thing Gokul, if the TA gives the exam, I am SOL. That guy is a total ASS, he WONT let me take the exam. I DO NOT like that TA.

The last quiz that TA wrote had 4 numerical mistakes in it. I spent a good half an hour on that quiz trying to figure out why the hell the numbers were not working out.

 

[Cyrus]

uhhhhhhhhhhh, add insult to injury.

Associate Professor D--- B---- was given the Poole & Kent Outstanding Teaching Award. This award is given to a senior faculty member for excellence in teaching. Dr. B--- is recognized as an enthusiastic teacher a leader in engineering curriculum development, and assisting his peers in developing their teaching skills and abilities.

Are you JOKING ME.....

 

[Pyrrhus]

Cyrus, relax do as others said, and hope for the best. That's all you can do for now.

 

[dav2008]

yep blame the other guy

it's easier that way

 

[Evo]

Sounds like an e-mail glitch where the e-mails weren't forwarded. You should be able to reason with him.

<hugs cyrus>

 

[Knavish]

I don't see why you're wasting your time with this. You have legit proof of your Saturday test. That's all that matters. Go show him your syllabus.

 

[Curious3141]

Cyrus, don't take this the wrong way, but hysterics and histrionics aren't going to accomplish anything now. Just keep things simple, approach him, show him the TT and take the damn make up exam.

You obviously have a lot of personal animus against the guy, and whether it's justified or not I don't know. I do know that, in this case, it's irrelevant to your approach to the situation. If he refuses to let you take the exam, you have an excellent case for a complaint, but that's ONLY if you've done everything humanly possible to straighten this out, instead of typing complaints on an internet forum.

I have your best interests at heart, so don't take this as a flame, I just don't want to see you screw up this course because of personal issues with him. Even if he's not being professional as a teacher, you be professional as a student, and things will work out for the best.

 

[Cyrus]

Oh, don't worry, my response to him was NOTHING like this thread. I explained to him that I did not get his email until today, and that we had already discussed taking the final on tuesday when I was in his office with him.

I left him a message on his office phone too, just in case there was an off chance he might be in his office on a saturday.

Don't get me wrong, he is a nice guy, but he is not professional as a teacher. Being unprepared is inexcusable.


If he says no, I am going to be up s-creek. Because now I have to go fight to get my final accepted while in the middle of all my other finals, that's just what I need right now...

 

[0TheSwerve0]

My brother had a similar problem with his English teacher a few years ago. He was seriously sick before and during the final, emailed the teacher about it and even got a doctor's note. He didn't show up for the exam, so the teacher failed him. He went through appeal after appeal, wrote letters, provided documentation, all to no avail. The teacher was a rule nazi and unforunately, the school board said it was up to her on what to do. After about a year of this, he finally gave up. Granted, he didn't try to get in contact with her until the weekend before, so maybe you'll have better luck.

 

[0TheSwerve0]

Don't get me wrong, he is a nice guy, but he is not professional as a teacher. Being unprepared is inexcusable.

Do you go to a school with a large number of students? With a high student to teacher ratio? I find that stupid sh!t like this often happens at schools like that.

 

[Curious3141]

My brother had a similar problem with his English teacher a few years ago. He was seriously sick before and during the final, emailed the teacher about it and even got a doctor's note. He didn't show up for the exam, so the teacher failed him. He went through appeal after appeal, wrote letters, provided documentation, all to no avail. The teacher was a rule nazi and unforunately, the school board said it was up to her on what to do. After about a year of this, he finally gave up. Granted, he didn't try to get in contact with her until the weekend before, so maybe you'll have better luck.

You should review the school policy on this. In some cases, as long as you're able to physically show up a the exam venue, you're required to take the exam. A doctor's note will go some way to explaining a bad performance *after* the exam has been taken and may make the exam board consider whether the grade should be based on previous work or a make up exam instituted, but it will not excuse the actual taking of the examination.

I suppose an obvious exception to the rule is if a student ends up bedridden with multiple fractures just before the examination, in which case, sometimes the teacher would expect the examination to be taken in the hospital.

If the student has varicella (chicken pox), provisions should be made for the exam to be taken at home rather than putting everyone who's non-immune in the exam hall at risk (airborne transmission).

In any case, you should make sure the doctor's note is as explicit as possible citing the exact condition and mobility of the patient, etc.

Again, it all depends on how flexible they're willing to be. Make up exams are not to be taken lightly. Think about it, it's difficult enough to set one exam. A make up exam is double the effort, and they have to be cautious about making the questions dissimilar enough from the main exam to discourage cheating, yet make them of a comparable standard to make grading possible.

 

[Cyrus]

Hey that's his problem. HE was the one that announced to the entire class that people taking the EE exam were welcomed to take it on tuesday instead. We are not talking about a doctors note here. And if you read his first email on thursday, he made NO mention of putting WHY, he just said, "give me your name." He even told me the same thing in his office. THEN he pulls this stupid stunt at 8:00 pm the night before, when he should have sent out this email at 8:00A.M. so people had time to reply back.

 

[Math Is Hard]

Cyrus, you are clearly in the right. Don't blow it by losing your temper though. Remain calm and make your case.

There is no way he could expect everyone to respond in that 4-hour window. He should have given 24 hours notice at the very, very least. What if a student had to work between 8-12? I know some who do. I'm appalled that the whole scheduling overlap situation occurred in the first place. I think if the school knew that a number of students would be enrolled in both EE and stats, they should have made sure the finals were not at the same date and time. Or, worst case, the scheduling and procedures for the alternate exam should have been clearly explained well in advance - as in weeks in advance.

 

[Cyrus]

They were not at the same time, but it was back to back. As in stat from 8-10 and EE from 10:30-12:30.

 

[Moonbear]

My brother had a similar problem with his English teacher a few years ago. He was seriously sick before and during the final, emailed the teacher about it and even got a doctor's note. He didn't show up for the exam, so the teacher failed him. He went through appeal after appeal, wrote letters, provided documentation, all to no avail. The teacher was a rule nazi and unforunately, the school board said it was up to her on what to do. After about a year of this, he finally gave up. Granted, he didn't try to get in contact with her until the weekend before, so maybe you'll have better luck.

I'm actually pretty surprised by this outcome. If he was sick and at the doctor's office at the time of the exam, the doctor's note should have been sufficient...unless you mean he went to the doctor's before the exam, in which case, unless he had something contagious, he should have showed up and appealed later for a re-test or leniency on the grading to account for being sick during the exam.

I helped proctor placement exams at the college I attended once...these are the exams the incoming freshmen take to help place them in proper math, English and foreign language courses (and when applicable, appropriate chemistry courses, because those were divided by math aptitude as well). The students are told their admission is contingent on taking these exams, no make-ups allowed, etc. Well, when I was proctoring, we had a student show up practically green with illness. One of the other proctors "took pity" and set a trash can next to the student so they wouldn't have to leave the room to vomit. The deans also help proctor these, but roam from exam room to exam room. When one arrived, took one look at the student and noted the reason for the trash can being where it was, they took her name and number and sent her home and arranged for a make-up. Illness that bad is an excuse. But, that's also why I'm advising Cyrus to show up to that Tuesday exam, no matter what he's told leading up to it. He can deal with whether it will be accepted after-the-fact (it doesn't even need to be appealed before final grades are issued...those can still be changed on appeal), but if he doesn't show up for it because the prof tells him it's too late, then there won't be any recourse if he hasn't taken it at all.

Curious, I think Cyrus is just venting to us because he's understandably upset and nervous about this. To have a syllabus that hasn't even been updated in 6 years is pretty lazy and inexcusable, and to just point to the school's honor code is unprofessional. A syllabus should include all the details of the course, not just a reading list, should be current, specify grading policies, dates and times of exams, what the instructor considers valid reasons to take a make-up exam, the procedure for arranging a make-up exam (including things like, "if you are sick and not hospitalized, show up for the exam and a determination will be made at that time if a make-up exam will be made available.) Even the format of the make-up exam should be specified...will it be the same as the rest of the class got, or a different exam, or oral instead of written, etc.? (Personal experience has taught me that oral make-up exams deter students with a minor case of sniffles from arguing illness.)

If Cyrus does have to appeal his grade based on issues with this make-up exam, I am quite certain the university administration will ensure this particular professor gets a lesson on writing a proper syllabus in time for his fall classes.

 

[FredGarvin]

Cyrus, why are you the only one that has issues like this? Do you thrive on this stress? You'll be dead by 27.

 

[Cyrus]

Update report:

Still no reply from this guy. I went to the ME department advisor, who said he has to let me take the exam. She called him and he was not at his office, so she left him a voice mail too. She also sent a message to the TA, who said he could not get a hold of the proff either. I seriously think the guy is out of town. The guy did not even post any office hours during exam week!

Un-freakin-believable

I am sick and tired of some of the crap they try to pull at this school.

On the up side, I got an 81 on my electronics exam, prof said he would give me an A-

 

[Curious3141]

Update report:

Still no reply from this guy. I went to the ME department advisor, who said he has to let me take the exam. She called him and he was not at his office, so she left him a voice mail too. She also sent a message to the TA, who said he could not get a hold of the proff either. I seriously think the guy is out of town. The guy did not even post any office hours during exam week!

Un-freakin-believable

I am sick and tired of some of the crap they try to pull at this school.

On the up side, I got an 81 on my electronics exam, prof said he would give me an A-

I do sympathise with you. This seems like a lot of unnecessary stress for you to have to go thru' before taking an exam. However, the course of action remains the same, just show up to take the exam on Tuesday and if he objects explain the situation and if he continues to say no, tell him you've been advised by senior administration that he has to let you take the exam. Maybe get a note to that effect right now from the ME advisor so there's no wiggle room.

I hope after this incident, you have no further classes with this guy, and I further hope it's an MCQ type exam for the most part, because teachers with a grudge have been known to mark students down (MCQs make it tough).

BTW, congrats on your Electronics grade.

 

[Moonbear]

Good luck on your final today, Cyrus! And congrats on the A in Electronics.

That's really weird that even the TA didn't know how to reach the prof. If he was heading out of town, you'd think he'd have at least made sure the TA knew so the TA could help answer student questions before the exam, and the department head should have known too.

 

[Cyrus]

Well, out of nowhere, he shows up today *right before the exam* and hands them out. He has no list of names, he doesn’t even care. He just said 'this is for the people who had the electronic exam or religious reasons, right?"

Then he gave out the test and kept walking away for 10 mins at a time. One guy finished and wanted to leave to his next exam, but was waiting around for him to get back to turn in his test. He got tired of waiting and shoved the test under the teacher’s door.

All I needed was a 77% to get an A. I think I easily achieved that or higher.

Oh, well that class is done. I SPANKED that test like a newborn baby.

 

[heartless]

good that everything has gone well. I'm not sure how it is with colleges, but 77% is quite low, get at least a 90 :P

Oh, well that class is done. I SPANKED that test like a newborn baby.

Cyrus... you're such a sadist

 

[Cyrus]

I did not say 77% was an A.

 

[mattmns]

Cool, good to hear it worked out Cyrus!

I just got my linear algebra final exam back and I got 100% on it

 

[Cyrus]

Dude, NICE!

Pengwunio should follow your lead...