How Can You Calculate the Area of a Snowflake Shape?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around calculating the area of a snowflake-like shape, exploring mathematical approaches to represent its area through series and geometric reasoning. Participants examine the implications of overlapping shapes and the rates at which the sizes of the boxes decrease.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant proposes a series to represent the area of the snowflake shape but encounters issues with potential overlaps between the boxes.
  • Another participant inquires about the rate of size decrease for the boxes, specifically questioning the dimensions of the boxes attached at each step.
  • A participant mentions using a factor of 1/2 for shrinking the squares and expresses interest in determining the minimum rate of size decrease to avoid overlaps.
  • One participant argues that the squares will not overlap and suggests that the entire plane will be filled, estimating the total area to be equal to 4.
  • Calculations are presented regarding the number of squares added at each step and the area contributed by each, leading to a derived sum that estimates the area to be 2.
  • A later reply suggests modifying the argument if a square with a smaller area is added each time.
  • Another participant confirms the area estimate of 2 through their own calculations.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the overlap of squares and the resulting area calculations, with no consensus reached on the final area or the implications of the size decrease factor.

Contextual Notes

Participants' calculations depend on assumptions about the size decrease of the boxes and the nature of overlaps, which remain unresolved. The discussion includes various mathematical steps that are not fully detailed.

Sczisnad
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http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/835/mathproblem.jpg/

I was thinking of an interesting shape (I drew it in paint for help), and if it would be possible to find the area of it. I started to write a series to represent the area but ran into trouble because I think that parts of the snowflake might overlap.

the formula that I started to work on is incomplete: 1 + 3/4 + [(Σ,∞,n=2) 12(3^(n-2))+...(incomplete)]

The "12(3^(n-2))" is the number of boxes in that layer, I was going to multiply that by the area of the individual boxes in that layer and then subtract the overlap. But that is where the problems might be.
 
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With what rate does the size of the boxes decrease? Your first box is 1x1, what size do the four boxes attached to that have? And what size do the boxes attached to that have?
 
opse sorry, when i was calculating it, I used a factor of 1/2 for shrinking the squares. However if that causes the squares to overlap I would like to find out what the minimum rate of size decrease is.
 
Sczisnad said:
opse sorry, when i was calculating it, I used a factor of 1/2 for shrinking the squares. However if that causes the squares to overlap I would like to find out what the minimum rate of size decrease is.

No, the squares won't overlap. However, I do expect that the entire plane get's filled this way and that the area is equal to 4.

Let's calculate this. First, let's see how many squares we have to add at each step:

At step 1, we have 1 square
At step 2, we add 4 squares
At step 3, we add 3\cdot 4=12 squares
At step 4, we add 324 squares
At step n, we add 3n-24

Now let's see what area we add every step:

At step 1, we add an area of 1.
At step 2, for each square we add, we will add an area of 1/4. However 1/4 of that area will overlap with our first square. So we only add an area of 1/4-1/16=3/16. We have 4 squares to add so we get 3/4.
At step 3, for each square we add, we will add an area of 1/16. However, 1/4 of that area will overlap with our original squares. So we only add an area of 1/16-1/64=3/64. We have 12 squares to add, so we get 9/16.
At step n, we add a square of dimensions 21-n. So we add an area of 22-2n. However, 1/4 of that area will overlap with the original squares. So we only add an area of

\frac{1}{2^{2n-2}}-\frac{1}{2^{2n}}=\frac{3}{2^{2n}}

We have 3n-24 squares to add, so we add

\frac{3^{n-1}}{2^{2n-2}} area.

So eventually we get the following sum:

\sum_{n=1}^{+\infty}{\frac{3^{n-1}}{2^{2n-2}}}=\frac{4}{3}\sum_{n=1}^{+\infty}{\left(\frac{3}{4}\right)^n}

Evaluating this gives an area of 2. Like expected.

Try to modify this argument if you add a square with a smaller area each time.
 
Last edited:

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