How Do You Calculate Uncertainties in Physics Problems?

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around calculating uncertainties in physics problems, specifically related to forces and weights in a system at equilibrium. The problem involves determining the total weight on a hook and the forces acting on multiple hooks, given specific measurements and their uncertainties.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Assumption checking, Conceptual clarification

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the application of the formula for uncertainty propagation and express confusion about how to apply it to their specific problem, particularly regarding the uncertainties associated with trigonometric functions. Some suggest different approaches to understanding error ranges, including engineering and statistical perspectives.

Discussion Status

There is an ongoing exploration of how to properly calculate uncertainties, with participants seeking clarification on the formula provided. Some guidance has been offered regarding different methods of handling uncertainties, but no consensus has been reached on a specific approach or solution.

Contextual Notes

Participants note the requirement for all answers to have three significant digits and the specific values for gravitational acceleration and mass, which are critical to the calculations. There is also mention of the need to understand the relationship between the uncertainties of sine and cosine functions in the context of the problem.

xyz_a
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Homework Statement



Remember: all answers (including uncertainties) must have three significant digits.
For all problems: use the value of g given: g = 9.802 m/s2
symimage.gif
0.0005 m/s2.

ac6da6c34f.png

Look at the diagram in the above image. Suppose the total mass of hook 2 is m2 = 951.0 g
symimage.gif
2.3 g, and θ = 31.90o
symimage.gif
0.07o, and the system is in equilibrium. Find the following quantities, with uncertainties:

- the total weight on hook 2. w2 = ___ N +/- ___ N

- the magnitude of the force on hook 1. F1 = ___ N +/- ___ N

- The magnitude of the total force on hook 3. F3 = ___ N +/- ___ N

Homework Equations


[/B]
F = m * a

The Attempt at a Solution



w2 = m * g = 0.9510 * 9.802 = 9.32N

F1 = 9.32 * cos(31.90) = 7.91N

F3 = 9.32 * sin(31.90) = 4.93N

I am just unable to solve the uncertainties. Someone else suggested that I use this equation Δf = df/dx*Δx + df/dy*Δy but I don't know how to use it or which values I have to use with it. Can someone please explain how I can do this? I'm really bad at solving uncertainties since I never really understood how to do it. Thank you.
 
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xyz_a said:

Homework Statement



Remember: all answers (including uncertainties) must have three significant digits.
For all problems: use the value of g given: g = 9.802 m/s2
symimage.gif
0.0005 m/s2.

ac6da6c34f.png

Look at the diagram in the above image. Suppose the total mass of hook 2 is m2 = 951.0 g
symimage.gif
2.3 g, and θ = 31.90o
symimage.gif
0.07o, and the system is in equilibrium. Find the following quantities, with uncertainties:

- the total weight on hook 2. w2 = ___ N +/- ___ N

- the magnitude of the force on hook 1. F1 = ___ N +/- ___ N

- The magnitude of the total force on hook 3. F3 = ___ N +/- ___ N

Homework Equations


[/B]
F = m * a

The Attempt at a Solution



w2 = m * g = 0.9510 * 9.802 = 9.32N

F1 = 9.32 * cos(31.90) = 7.91N

F3 = 9.32 * sin(31.90) = 4.93N

I am just unable to solve the uncertainties. Someone else suggested that I use this equation Δf = df/dx*Δx + df/dy*Δy but I don't know how to use it or which values I have to use with it. Can someone please explain how I can do this? I'm really bad at solving uncertainties since I never really understood how to do it. Thank you.
There are two essentially different appeoaches to dealing with error ranges. One engineering approach is to consider, literally, the range of possible values consistent with the given information. This is used where e.g. machine tolerances are critical in manufacturing. More common in scientific circles is to treat the ranges as representing some (unstated) number of standard deviations of a normally distributed error. In this approach one adds up variances. See http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Propagation_of_uncertainty#Simplification
 
haruspex said:
There are two essentially different appeoaches to dealing with error ranges. One engineering approach is to consider, literally, the range of possible values consistent with the given information. This is used where e.g. machine tolerances are critical in manufacturing. More common in scientific circles is to treat the ranges as representing some (unstated) number of standard deviations of a normally distributed error. In this approach one adds up variances. See http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Propagation_of_uncertainty#Simplification

Honestly I don't understand how to use it. That was my main issue since I did state in the first post that I did not knew how to use the formula I had been given or which values I had to use, especially since it involves uncertainties of sin and cos.
Can someone please try to explain this step by step or even with a similar example? I don't want anyone to do this for me, I just want to be able to understand properly so that I can do it myself.
 
xyz_a said:
Honestly I don't understand how to use it. That was my main issue since I did state in the first post that I did not knew how to use the formula I had been given or which values I had to use, especially since it involves uncertainties of sin and cos.
Can someone please try to explain this step by step or even with a similar example? I don't want anyone to do this for me, I just want to be able to understand properly so that I can do it myself.
There are lots of useful references online. Rather than rewriting it in my own words, I've looked around for an easier text than the one I linked before. Try this one: http://lectureonline.cl.msu.edu/~mmp/labs/error/e2.htm.
 

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