How exactly does the pion decay through the weak force?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on the decay of the pion through the weak force, exploring the interactions between quarks and the role of W bosons in this process. Participants examine the theoretical underpinnings of pion decay, the reversibility of the reaction, and the nature of the weak interaction as described by the standard model.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants describe the pion(+) as composed of an up quark and a down antiquark, which emits a W+ boson that subsequently decays into a muon and a muon-neutrino.
  • There is a question about whether the reaction can proceed in both directions, suggesting that a pion(+) could transform into a W+ boson and revert back to a pion(+).
  • Participants discuss the implications of the initial and final states being the same, questioning how this differs from a pion remaining stable.
  • One participant proposes that there may be a measurable phase involving the W+ boson, which could account for variations in decay times of different pions.
  • Another participant notes that the interaction between up quarks and down antiquarks to produce the W+ boson is a fundamental assumption of the standard model, though the underlying reasons for this interaction remain uncertain.
  • There is a reference to the weak current, which includes terms involving pairs of fermions, either quark plus antiquark or lepton plus neutrino.
  • Some participants express that while the assumptions align with experimental results, the fundamental "why" behind these interactions is not fully understood.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express uncertainty regarding the reversibility of the pion decay process and the nature of the interactions involved. There is no consensus on the specifics of how up quarks and down antiquarks interact to produce the W+ boson, nor on the implications of the decay process.

Contextual Notes

Participants acknowledge that the understanding of pion decay relies on assumptions within the standard model, and the discussion highlights the limitations in explaining the fundamental reasons behind these interactions.

Simfish
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So the pion(+)n is made up of an up quark and a down antiquark. And somehow, it emits a W+ boson, which then turns into a muon and a muon-neutrino.

From the Wiki article, "W bosons can decay to a lepton and neutrino or to an up-type quark and a down-type quark."

Does this mean that the reaction can go in both directions? Meaning that a pion(+) could turn into a W+ boson, which then turns back into a pion(+)?

And how do the up quark and down antiquark interact to produce that W+ boson?
 
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Simfish said:
Does this mean that the reaction can go in both directions? Meaning that a pion(+) could turn into a W+ boson, which then turns back into a pion(+)?

How could you tell? The initial state and the final state are the same. How would this be different from the pion just sitting there?

As far as "do the up quark and down antiquark interact to produce that W+ boson", what kind of answer are you looking for?
 
How could you tell? The initial state and the final state are the same. How would this be different from the pion just sitting there?

Perhaps there is a phase where you can measure the W+ boson (if that's possible). Alternatively, this could explain why some pions take longer than "usual" to decay. (as opposed to other particles that decay through an irreversible route)

As far as "do the up quark and down antiquark interact to produce that W+ boson", what kind of answer are you looking for?

Basically, I want to know if pion decay is phenomenological. Or in other words, why do up quarks interact with down antiquarks to produce the W+ boson?
 
why do up quarks interact with down antiquarks to produce the W+ boson?
This is one of the basic assumptions that go into the standard model, namely that the weak interaction can be described by Wμjμ where jμ is the weak current. The weak current is a sum of terms, each term containing a pair of fermions, either quark plus antiquark or lepton plus neutrino.

I guess the real answer to 'why' is that ultimately no one knows why, but if we make that assumption it agrees with experiment.
 
Simfish said:
So the pion(+)n is made up of an up quark and a down antiquark. And somehow, it emits a W+ boson, which then turns into a muon and a muon-neutrino.

From the Wiki article, "W bosons can decay to a lepton and neutrino or to an up-type quark and a down-type quark."

Does this mean that the reaction can go in both directions? Meaning that a pion(+) could turn into a W+ boson, which then turns back into a pion(+)?

And how do the up quark and down antiquark interact to produce that W+ boson?

Informative picture here: http://www.animatedphysics.com/baryon_decay/muon_spin.jpg of the main particles - Pion/Muon/Electron

The boson is around for a much smaller timescale, a high concenetration of energy, around just long enough for the pion to change into a muon.
 

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