How to Create 20 000 Gauss Inside a Copper Dodecahedron with Magnets?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the feasibility of creating a magnetic field of approximately 20,000 gauss inside a copper dodecahedron using magnets. Participants explore the relationship between distance and magnetic field strength, the types of magnets suitable for the project, and the directional nature of magnetic fields.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions whether the magnetic field around a magnet increases with distance, noting an observation that magnetic flux appears to increase with a larger air gap.
  • Another participant asserts that the largest magnetic field occurs when the air gap is minimized, explaining that it is hardest to separate magnets when they are in close proximity.
  • A participant references a historical magnet at UC Berkeley, providing details about its field strength and dimensions, suggesting that achieving high gauss values requires specific configurations.
  • There is a discussion about the types of magnets, with neodymium magnets having a surface gauss of 13,000 and ferrite magnets at 4,000, raising the question of which would be more effective for the project.
  • Participants emphasize the directional nature of magnetic fields, indicating that the field inside the dodecahedron must be oriented between the north and south poles of the magnets.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the relationship between distance and magnetic field strength, with some asserting that the field strength decreases with distance while others suggest that magnetic flux can appear to increase with a larger air gap. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the best approach to achieve the desired magnetic field strength inside the dodecahedron.

Contextual Notes

Participants have not fully resolved the assumptions regarding the effects of air gap on magnetic field strength and the specific configurations needed to achieve high gauss values. There are also dependencies on the definitions of magnetic field strength and the properties of different types of magnets.

Gauss20000
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Does the magnetic field around a magnet increase when the distance away from the magnet increases? While using a calculator for magnetic flux I noticed that the magnetic flux increases when the air gap increases. So does this mean the magnetic field of a magnet will increase the further you are away from it?

For my project I have made a large copper dodecahedron structure that I wish to attach 12 magnets in at various points to create approx. 20 000 gauss inside of it. Is this possible? What size magnets will I need to do this?

Neodymium magnets have surface gauss of 13000 and ferrite magnets have 4000gauss. which should I use?
 
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Gauss20000 said:
Does the magnetic field around a magnet increase when the distance away from the magnet increases? While using a calculator for magnetic flux I noticed that the magnetic flux increases when the air gap increases. So does this mean the magnetic field of a magnet will increase the further you are away from it?

For my project I have made a large copper dodecahedron structure that I wish to attach 12 magnets in at various points to create approx. 20 000 gauss inside of it. Is this possible? What size magnets will I need to do this?

Neodymium magnets have surface gauss of 13000 and ferrite magnets have 4000gauss. which should I use?

You will get the largest magnetic field (all other things equal) when the air gap is the smallest. That's why it's hardest to separate magnets when they are stuck together, and it gets eaiser and easier the fatrher apart you pull them.

As for creating a magnetic field inside of an object, remember that magnetic field is directional (a vector field). Your field inside the object has to be between two things, fromm one N pole to the other S pole, with the return of the field inside the magnet from S to N.
 
There was a magnet at UC Berkeley that had a 24,000 Gauss central field, The magnet gap was about 20 inches, and the pole tip diameter was about 184" (E. O. Lawrence's cyclotron). I'm told that the field was about 16,000 Gauss iron, and 8,000 Gauss Helmholz coil. It weighed about 4,000 tons.
Bob S
[Added] See this GMW electromagnet, and especially the plot of maximum field strength on the specification page.
http://www.gmw.com/electromagnets/dipole/3474/3474.html
The magnet will go to 30,000 gauss, but only with a pole tip gap under 20 mm.
 
Last edited:
berkeman said:
You will get the largest magnetic field (all other things equal) when the air gap is the smallest. That's why it's hardest to separate magnets when they are stuck together, and it gets eaiser and easier the fatrher apart you pull them.

As for creating a magnetic field inside of an object, remember that magnetic field is directional (a vector field). Your field inside the object has to be between two things, fromm one N pole to the other S pole, with the return of the field inside the magnet from S to N.

Thanks Berkeman. I had fogotten to consider this directional point.
 

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