I want to know the exact problems of Merging GR and QM

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the challenges of merging General Relativity (GR) and Quantum Mechanics (QM), specifically focusing on the mathematical anomalies that prevent their unification. Participants explore the theoretical implications and existing literature on the topic, as well as the limitations of current models in physics.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation
  • Exploratory

Main Points Raised

  • One participant requests detailed mathematical insights into why Einstein's field equations and Schrödinger's equation cannot be fused, indicating a desire for a deeper understanding of the anomalies involved.
  • Another participant notes that quantum mechanics allows for superpositions of states, while GR provides a unique spacetime geometry, suggesting a fundamental incompatibility between the two theories.
  • Efforts to quantize GR are mentioned as leading to non-renormalizable theories, with the expectation that quantum effects of gravity may not be observable until the Planck scale, which is currently beyond experimental reach.
  • A participant expresses a desire for a "soft" peer review and seeks comprehensive mathematical information on the subject, indicating a concern about the costs associated with formal journal submissions.
  • Moderators highlight the existence of extensive review articles on quantum gravity that discuss the issues and limitations of current solutions, suggesting these as starting points for further inquiry.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the breadth of the original question, with some arguing it is too broad and others seeking specific mathematical details. There is no consensus on how to approach the topic or the necessity of peer review within the forum context.

Contextual Notes

The discussion reflects limitations in the participants' understanding of the existing literature and the complexity of the mathematical frameworks involved. There is an acknowledgment of the need for specific questions rather than broad inquiries.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be of interest to those studying theoretical physics, particularly in the fields of quantum gravity, general relativity, and quantum mechanics, as well as individuals seeking to understand the challenges of unifying these theories.

VIctor Medvil
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This thread is I want a set of experts in the subject to show me the exact math of why Einstein's field Equations along with Special Relativity and Schrödinger's Equation along with deeper QM like QFT cannot be fused with GR. I want to see the exact anomalies in the equations myself from the view of Standard Physics for analysis in a speculative model of Quantum Gravity in another forum as that is against the rules of physicsforums.com
 
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VIctor Medvil said:
I want a set of experts in the subject to show me the exact math of why Einstein's field Equations along with Special Relativity and Schrödinger's Equation along with deeper QM like QFT cannot be fused with GR

This is way too broad a question. There is plenty of literature on this topic already. You have marked this thread as "A" level indicating a graduate level background with the subject matter; that means you should already have encountered at least some of the existing literature that deals with this question.

A very general answer would be that quantum mechanics requires that any physical system can exist in a superposition of states with probabilities for different results of measurements; but GR does not model spacetime this way, it gives one unique spacetime geometry. Efforts to quantize GR along the same lines as other field theories lead to a non-renormalizable theory; and heuristically, we don't expect quantum effects of gravity to show up until the Planck scale, which is about 20 orders of magnitude out of reach of our current experiments, so we have no way of exploring possible quantum effects of gravity experimentally to guide our theorizing.
 
PeterDonis said:
This is way too broad a question. There is plenty of literature on this topic already. You have marked this thread as "A" level indicating a graduate level background with the subject matter; that means you should already have encountered at least some of the existing literature that deals with this question.

A very general answer would be that quantum mechanics requires that any physical system can exist in a superposition of states with probabilities for different results of measurements; but GR does not model spacetime this way, it gives one unique spacetime geometry. Efforts to quantize GR along the same lines as other field theories lead to a non-renormalizable theory; and heuristically, we don't expect quantum effects of gravity to show up until the Planck scale, which is about 20 orders of magnitude out of reach of our current experiments, so we have no way of exploring possible quantum effects of gravity experimentally to guide our theorizing.

I do, I would like to peer review this concept and to do this I need detailed math on the subject in the current models of physics. I would like your viewpoint.
 
VIctor Medvil said:
I would like to peer review this concept

That's not what PF is for. Peer reviewing is something that should be done with scientific papers before they are published and become topics of discussion here. So you would need to contact journals that send out papers for review.
 
Let's call this a "Soft" peer review. I would like all information you know about this subject in math. I am not going to waste 2 grand or more in journal publishing fees without knowing it has a chance for success in mainstream physics.
 
VIctor Medvil said:
I would like all information you know about this subject in math.

Sorry, that's too broad, as I've already said. You need to do the work yourself of reading the literature and finding specific questions to ask.

Thread closed.
 
The moderators were contacted with the idea this thread would benefit others reading it from one last post - so here it is.

A science adviser wanted it mentioned there are many long review articles on quantum gravity that discuss the issues and also problems and limitations of current solution attempts. Each of these is typically over 50 pages with hundreds of references. These are where you should start:
https://arxiv.org/abs/0907.4238
https://arxiv.org/abs/1507.08194

I always personally post the following paper that gives a different take on the whole thing:
https://arxiv.org/abs/1209.3511

Thread now shut - permanently.

Thanks
Bill
 
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