If an electron is not a point particle how does current flow

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the visualization of electron and hole flow through a conductor, particularly in light of modern theories that suggest electrons are not point particles but rather exist as energy clouds around atoms. Participants explore how to represent this concept in an animation while considering the implications of current flow in different materials.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested
  • Experimental/applied

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses a desire to create an animation that accurately depicts electron and hole flow, moving away from the traditional solar system model of electrons jumping between atoms.
  • Another participant notes that there is no absolute description of electrons in solids and that different models may fit various scenarios better, emphasizing that conduction is a statistical phenomenon involving charge carrier populations.
  • This participant also explains that conduction electrons drift under an applied potential and that their movement can be described statistically, without necessitating a quantum mechanical description.
  • A third participant suggests considering the target audience for the animation and recommends selecting specific materials and conditions (e.g., solid, gas, plasma) to model current flow accurately.
  • They also mention the importance of distinguishing between different types of currents, such as those involving electrons, holes, and ions.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants appear to have differing views on the best way to visualize electron and hole flow, with some advocating for a statistical approach while others are focused on the conceptual representation of these phenomena. No consensus is reached regarding a definitive method for visualization.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include the lack of a unified model for electron behavior in solids and the dependence on specific definitions of current types and materials. The discussion also reflects varying levels of familiarity with quantum mechanics and its implications for conduction.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be useful for individuals interested in visualizing electrical conduction, educators seeking to explain complex concepts in semiconductor physics, and those involved in creating educational animations related to physics and engineering.

spycatcher
Messages
2
Reaction score
0
Gday All
First time post here.
I am trying to construct an animation of electron and hole flow through a conductor.
I understand that the theory now is that electrons are not really like the old solar system model ,but more like energy cloud layers around an atom ,how would you go about visualizing the electron and hole flow through a conductor using the concepts of this theory .
The old system I used was an electron jumping from atom to atom as the hole moved in the other direction.
This does not seem to be quite right now in view of the better understanding we have of the inner workings of the Atom.
Thank you all for your time and consideration
Peter
 
Physics news on Phys.org
There is no absolute description of electrons in solids---it is just that some descriptions fit certain scenarios better.
Demonstrating electron-hole driven conduction does not 'require' the cloud (wavefunction) description, even though the underlying mechanism is quantum. Conduction is a statistical phenomenon, where one talks in terms of population of charge carriers.
SOME electrons in the solid have energies high enough for conduction. A conduction electron, being high in mobility, drifts under the applied potential (i.e., carries current), until it is absorbed by another atom similar to the one the electron got freed from (i.e., a hole). Each step in this process occurs with a probability so the picture of electrons jumping from site to site is statistically correct, and does not require a quantum description. However, (a) the conduction phenomenon does not occur only through contiguous sites, and (b) electron release and electron capture are independent events.
 
I'll give you some ideas if you'll post your animation here! ...Likely you can find animations that already exist via Google/Yahoo of 'current animation' or similar...I have not looked.

Most important: Decide who will be your audience...that is, who are your 'customers'?

I'd suggest you first decide what kind of material you are trying to animate.

Some types are here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electric_current


All "currents" are not quite the same: So choose from among electrons, holes, and ions, etc.

You'll also want to decide what at temperatures you'll be modelling...solid,gas, plasma, superconductivity, etc

For ion flow electrolytes...like in a car battery. [I don't know if there are any solid electrolytes...not in everday use that I am aware.]

For semiconductors, which requires hole and electron concepts...try here for some information and illustrations:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semiconductor
 
Sorry I have not been able to get back online sooner .
Thank you all for your kind assistance .
Best Regards
peter
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
1K
  • · Replies 22 ·
Replies
22
Views
8K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
3K
  • · Replies 16 ·
Replies
16
Views
4K
  • · Replies 62 ·
3
Replies
62
Views
10K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 22 ·
Replies
22
Views
9K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 25 ·
Replies
25
Views
4K
  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
2K