Index Transformation: Understanding Notation & Index Rules

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around understanding index notation and transformations related to the substantial derivative in fluid dynamics. Participants are examining specific equations involving vector and tensor quantities, exploring the implications of notation and the relationships between terms in the context of their mathematical derivations.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses confusion over the transformation of the substantial derivative and its representation in index notation, questioning the interpretation of terms like \(\omega_i \omega_i\) as \(1/2 \omega^2\).
  • Another participant requests clarification on notation, specifically the significance of the capital \(D\) in differentiation and the nature of the quantities involved (\(\omega\), \(v\), and \(S\)).
  • A participant clarifies that the capital \(D\) refers to the substantial derivative and provides its definition, along with the identification of \(\omega\) and \(v\) as vectors and \(S_{ij}\) as a second-order tensor.
  • One participant acknowledges a typo in their earlier post regarding the notation and expresses concern about mixing index and symbolic notation.
  • Another participant attempts to derive the substantial derivative of \(\frac{\omega^2}{2}\) using the chain rule, linking it back to the original equation but still struggles with the transformation in index notation.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants are engaged in clarifying notation and definitions, but there is no consensus on the interpretation of certain terms or the transformation process in index notation. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the specific transformation and its implications.

Contextual Notes

There are indications of missing assumptions about the definitions of the quantities involved and the rules of index notation. The discussion also highlights potential confusion arising from mixing different notational forms.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be useful for students or practitioners in fluid dynamics or related fields who are grappling with index notation, substantial derivatives, and the mathematical representation of vector and tensor quantities.

Peregrine
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In my struggles to understand index notation, I am trying to figure out how my book came up with the following transformation.

\frac {D \omega}{Dt} \cdot \omega = \omega_j \partial_j v_i \cdot \omega + \nu \partial_j \partial_j \omega_i \cdot \omega
=
\frac {D \frac{\omega^2}{2}}{Dt} = \omega_i \omega_j S_{ji} + \nu \partial_j \partial_j \frac {\omega^2}{2} - \nu \partial_j \omega_i \partial_j \omega_i

This is how far I got.

changing \frac {D \omega}{Dt} \cdot \omega to index notation yields

\omega_i \partial_o \omega_i + \omega_i v_j \partial_j \omega_i = \omega_i \omega_j \partial_j v_i + \omega_i \nu \partial_j \partial_j \omega_i

Looking back to the book's solution, this appears to say \omega_i \omega_i = 1/2 \omega^2? I thought it would be simple \omega^2?

Then, it is pretty clear to me that \omega_i \omega_j \partial_j v_i = S_{ji}, so the term

\omega_i \omega_j \partial_j v_i = \omega_i \omega_j S_{ji}

Finally, looking at \omega_i \nu \partial_j \partial_j \omega_i, I get, from the chain rule,

\nu \omega_i \omega_i \partial_j \partial_j + \nu \omega_i \partial_j \partial_j \omega_i

which can be rewritten as

\nu \partial_j \partial_j \omega_i \omega_i + \nu \partial_j \omega_i \partial_j \omega_i

So again, I run into \omega_i \omega_i = 1/2 \omega^2, which I don't understand.

First, have I don this correctly, and second, any ideas? Thanks much.
 
Last edited:
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Can you perhaps explain your notation? For example, in your first equation you are using capital Ds for differentiation (I assume that there is some particular reason for this). So, if you can answer the following questions then somebody here should be able to help you:

1) What's the significance of the upper case D in the differentiation?
2) What types of objects are \omega, v, and S?
3) What's your understanding of the summation rule? For instance, in the first equation you have a term in which three quantities all have the same index. Given that it seems that both \omega and v are either one-forms or vectors, this term doesn't make sense.
 
1. Capital D refers to the substantial derivative, in the notation of Stokes. It boils down to:

\frac {D()}{Dt} = \frac {\partial ()}{\partial t} + v_i \partial_i ()

Also, in the index notation of my book, \frac {\partial ()}{\partial t} = \partial_o

2. w is a vector. v is a vector. And Sij is a 2nd order tensor.

3. You caught a typo in my writing. The term you speak of should have been \omega_j \partial_j v_i \cdot \omega. I corrected this in the initial post.

Also, I do understand that the first equation I gave mixes index and symbolic notation, but that's how the book presented it, even though it seems to me to be bad form.

Thanks for taking a look at this. I understand this is probably a pretty simplistic problem for most here, but I am having a tough time understanding.
 
Last edited:
Okay, so looking at this backwards makes sense.

Since w is general, and thus can be f(x,y,z,t)

\frac {D \frac{\omega^2}{2}}{Dt} differentiated by the chain rule gives:

\frac{2 \omega}{2} \frac{D \omega}{Dt}

= \omega \cdot \frac{D \omega}{Dt}

So, looking at it backwards makes it apparent that

\omega_i \frac{D}{Dt} \omega_i = \omega \cdot \frac {D \omega}{Dt}

But I still don't see the transformation in index notation.
 

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