Is E/B = c for spherical EM Wave in Vacuum?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on the relationship between the electric field (E) and magnetic field (B) in spherical electromagnetic (EM) waves in a vacuum, particularly whether the ratio E/B equals the speed of light (c) as it does for plane waves. Participants explore this concept in the context of spherical waves expanding from a point source, such as in a light cone.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants assert that the ratio E/B = c holds for spherical waves, similar to plane waves, arguing that spherical waves consist of many straight lines propagating in different directions.
  • Others propose that the relationship E/H is related to the intrinsic impedance of free space, approximately 377 ohms, suggesting a different perspective on the wave properties.
  • A participant mentions that in modern technology, waves generated from dipole antennas resemble spherical waves but satisfy the relation E = cB only in the far field.
  • Another participant questions whether the far field limit implies that the wave type approaches a planar wave, indicating a potential distinction in behavior between spherical and plane waves.
  • Some participants argue that the relation E/B = c is only valid for plane waves in the far zone, referencing multipole expansion to support their claims.
  • Others counter that the wave front remains spherical even in the far zone, emphasizing the importance of angular distribution.
  • It is noted that even a spherical wave can asymptotically resemble a plane wave in the far-field region, depending on the source distribution.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on whether the relationship E/B = c applies to spherical waves, with some asserting it does and others contending it is limited to plane waves in the far zone. The discussion remains unresolved, with multiple competing perspectives present.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference various aspects of wave behavior, including the far field limit and multipole expansion, which may introduce limitations or assumptions that are not fully explored in the discussion.

LarryS
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TL;DR
Is E/B = c for spherical EM Wave in Vacuum?
In classical EM, consider an EM plane wave traveling in free space. The ratio of the amplitude of the electric field to the amplitude of the magnetic field is the velocity of the wave, the speed of light.

Is the above also true if the wave is spherical, expanding from a point source, as in a light cone?

Thanks in advance.
 
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LarryS said:
Summary: Is E/B = c for spherical EM Wave in Vacuum?

Is the above also true if the wave is spherical, expanding from a point source, as in a light cone?
I don't think this should matter.
Light travels in straight lines in free space, and spherical waves are also composed of countless straight lines propagating in different directions. As long as you zoom into see the detail anywhere and imagine that it's just one of the straight lines, the conclusion should be the same.
 
yes, E=cB (or E=B in Gaussian units) for spherical waves.
 
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I would like to add that in modern technology the transmitted waves (for radio, television, mobile phones)are generated from dipole antennas (or array of dipole antennas) and the fields of a dipole antenna kind of look like spherical waves but satisfy the relation ##E=cB## only in the far field.
 
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Delta2 said:
I would like to add that in modern technology the transmitted waves (for radio, television, mobile phones)are generated from dipole antennas (or array of dipole antennas) and the fields of a dipole antenna kind of look like spherical waves but satisfy the relation ##E=cB## only in the far field.
Are you saying that because in the far field limit the wave type approaches planar?
 
LarryS said:
Are you saying that because in the far field limit the wave type approaches planar?
The far field takes the form of a radiating spherical wave, but I said it because that's what the formulas for the far field of a dipole antenna tell us. You might find of use the following wikipedia article

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dipole#Dipole_radiation
 
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The said relation only holds for plane waves, i.e. in the "far zone". This becomes clear from the multipole expansion.
 
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The wave front is spherical, even in the far zone. Otherwise, there would be no angular distribution.
 
  • #10
Even a spherical wave looks asymptotically like a plane wave. Just look at the multipole expansion in the far-field region, ##r \rightarrow \infty##, assuming that the source (charge-current distribution) is localized around the origin.
 
  • #11
"looks"
Dipole:
\begin{equation}
{\bf E}=-{\bf{\hat r}\times B}=
\frac{k^2e^{ikr}}{r}[{\bf p-( p\cdot{\hat r}){\hat r}}]
\end{equation}
 

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