Is the Proton-Electron Theory Disproved by Experimental Evidence?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on the validity of the proton-electron theory, particularly in light of experimental evidence. Participants explore theoretical implications, experimental observations, and the foundational aspects of particle physics related to nucleons and their interactions.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions what experimental evidence, aside from proton-proton scattering, disproves the idea that neutrons are composed of protons and electrons, as suggested by Heisenberg.
  • Another participant asserts that quantum mechanics does not permit bound states of a proton and electron at the relevant size and energy scales, suggesting that such a configuration would disrupt atomic electrons.
  • A question is posed regarding the spin of a hypothetical proton-electron bound state and how it would relate to the known spin of neutrons.
  • One participant claims that cloud chamber experiments have demonstrated the existence of quarks, which they argue disproves the proton-electron theory.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the validity of the proton-electron theory, with some questioning its experimental support and others citing evidence that challenges it. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the definitive experimental falsification of the theory.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference specific theoretical frameworks and experimental setups without reaching a consensus on the implications of these discussions for the proton-electron theory.

Comanche
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Hi,

I read Georgi's Lie algebras in Particle Physics 2nd chap5 and have two questions.

1) In the beginning he mentioned Heisenberg regarded neutron is composed as proton and electron, the force between nucleons are exchanging electrons. My question is, what is the experimental evidence falsifies this idea (except proton proton scattering in accelerators)?

2) In p81, he built multiparticle states by successively adding creation operators
a^{\dagger}_{N,1/2,\alpha_1} \cdots a^{\dagger}_{N,1/2,\alpha_n} | 0 >

My question is, is that just a basis of multiparticle eigenstate of Hamiltonian? Imagine there is a vacuum. I first created a helium nuclei, then add a single electron. When I add the second electron, the helium electronic eigenstate will not be a tensor product of two single-electron state. The tensor product is just a two-electron (plus a nuclei) basis. Back to the equation of multiparticle state, is that just a basis?

Similarly for many hadrons, like u\bar{d}, is that a basis or a notation means the pion contains u and \bar{d}?

Thank you very much in advance
 
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Comanche said:
1) In the beginning he mentioned Heisenberg regarded neutron is composed as proton and electron, the force between nucleons are exchanging electrons. My question is, what is the experimental evidence falsifies this idea (except proton proton scattering in accelerators)?
QM does not allow bound states of proton+electron within that size and energy, and those electrons would disturb the "other" electrons in atoms.
 
If the neutron were a proton-electron bound state, what would be its spin? What is the neutron's spin?
 
Vanadium 50 said:
If the neutron were a proton-electron bound state, what would be its spin? What is the neutron's spin?

thanks! only the first question left...
 
Last edited:
well cloud chambers proved the existence of quarks thereby disproving the proton-electron theory if your asking for experimental evidence.
 

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