Is the spin group spin(n) a double cover for O(n)?

  • Context: Undergrad 
  • Thread starter Thread starter redtree
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Group Spin
Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on the relationship between the spin group spin(n) and the orthogonal group O(n), particularly exploring the nature of double covers in the context of different types of quadratic forms, including definite and semidefinite forms.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that every rotation in O(n) should map to spin(n), despite some rotations not being continuously connected to the identity.
  • It is noted that spin(n) is the double cover of SO(n), while Pin(n) is the double cover of O(n), with a reference to the Wikipedia page for further details.
  • One participant questions why the properties of the pin group for definite forms do not extend to semidefinite quadratic forms, referencing the Wikipedia page for context.
  • Another participant clarifies that Pin(p,q) is indeed the double cover of O(p,q) and discusses the connectivity of elements in this context, particularly for semidefinite forms.
  • A participant expresses a need for clarification regarding their understanding of the connectivity of elements in Pin(p,q) to O(p,q) for semidefinite forms.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the properties of the pin group in relation to semidefinite forms, indicating that the discussion remains unresolved regarding the implications of these properties.

Contextual Notes

There are limitations in the discussion regarding the assumptions made about the connectivity of elements in the pin group and the orthogonal group, particularly in the context of semidefinite quadratic forms.

redtree
Messages
335
Reaction score
15
TL;DR
The elements of the orthogonal group O(n) may not be continuously connected as in SO(n), but it seems that they should bijectively map to spin(n) for ##n\geq 3##
Every rotation in O(n) seems like it should map to spin(n) even if some rotations are not continuously connected to the identity.
 
Physics news on Phys.org
##Spin\left(n\right)## is the double cover of ##SO\left(n\right)##, while ##Pin\left(n\right)## is the double cover of ##O\left(n\right)##. The name is a pun. See (and references therein)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pin_group
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: redtree and vanhees71
Thanks! I read the link (and much else).

From the Wikipedia page: "The pin group of a definite form maps onto the orthogonal group, and each component is simply connected: it double covers the orthogonal group. The pin groups for a positive definite quadratic form Q and for its negative −Q are not isomorphic, but the orthogonal groups are."

Why doesn't the same hold true for semidefinite quadratic forms?
 
redtree said:
From the Wikipedia page: "The pin group of a definite form maps onto the orthogonal group, and each component is simply connected: it double covers the orthogonal group. The pin groups for a positive definite quadratic form Q and for its negative −Q are not isomorphic, but the orthogonal groups are."

Why doesn't the same hold true for semidefinite quadratic forms?
##\mathrm{Pin}\left(p.q\right)## is a double cover of ##\mathrm{O}\left(p.q\right)##. Is this what you mean?
 
I apologize. My question was poorly worded.

Pin##(p,q)## is the double cover of ##O(p,q)##. For a definite form, each element in Pin##(p,q)## is simply connected to ##O(p,q)##.

My question: for a semidefinite form, Pin##(p,q)## is still the double cover of ##O(p,q)##, but each element in Pin##(p,q)## is NOT simply connected to ##O(p,q)##. Is my understanding correct?
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
1K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
3K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
5K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
3K
  • · Replies 36 ·
2
Replies
36
Views
5K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K