Lagrange EOM for 2 masses on a string

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around deriving the equations of motion for a system of two masses connected by a string, utilizing Lagrange's equations. Participants are exploring the kinetic and potential energy components of the system, as well as the role of tension in the strings.

Discussion Character

  • Homework-related
  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses confusion about the potential energy of the system, noting the need to account for both gravitational potential energy and the effects of tension in the strings.
  • Another participant suggests that the potential energy should include terms for the work done by tension, specifically in the y components, and questions the logic regarding the string connecting the two masses.
  • There is mention of specific terms for potential energy, including m1gy1 and m2gy2, as well as terms involving the angles of the strings.
  • One participant indicates a struggle to understand the potential energy aspect of the problem and seeks further clarification.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not appear to reach a consensus on how to incorporate the tension into the potential energy calculations, and there is ongoing uncertainty regarding the correct approach to the problem.

Contextual Notes

Participants are grappling with the definitions and assumptions related to potential energy and the role of tension in the system, which may affect their understanding of the equations of motion.

stigg
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Homework Statement



Derive the equation of motion for the system in figure 6.4 using Lagrange's equations

[/B]
upload_2015-3-16_18-26-58.png


Homework Equations


m1=.5m
m2=m
strings are massless and in constant tension

Lagrange=T-V

The Attempt at a Solution


I currently have the kinetic energy as .5m1y'12 + .5m2y'22

I am confused regarding the potential energy of the system. I understand each mass will have an m*g*y component associated with them but i am unsure how the tension plays into the potential energy. Once i have the potential energy for the system i can take it from there. Any advice would be greatly appreciated, thanks!
 

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Greetings,
So here is the how to 1:Short document:
Find me EoM!
2:Long video:

Note: I am going to get some sleep...If that is not what you asked for, please wait for someone else to answer you or @ToBePhysics so I can get to you when I am done doing things.
 
Last edited:
Hmm interesting video but I am afraid something is just not clicking for me with regards to this problem.

for the potential energy there will be a m1gy1 term and a m2gy2 term. I assume there must also be terms for the work done by the tension in the strings, but only the y components as these are only given one DOF each. That would give a Ty1sin(θ1) and Ty2sin(θ3) correct? assuming θ1 is the angle between the left wall and that string and θ3 is the angle between the right wall and the attached string.

My confusion is coming when i need to take into account the string attaching the two masses. Is my logic correct thus far?
 
stigg said:
Hmm interesting video but I am afraid something is just not clicking for me with regards to this problem.

for the potential energy there will be a m1gy1 term and a m2gy2 term. I assume there must also be terms for the work done by the tension in the strings, but only the y components as these are only given one DOF each. That would give a Ty1sin(θ1) and Ty2sin(θ3) correct? assuming θ1 is the angle between the left wall and that string and θ3 is the angle between the right wall and the attached string.

My confusion is coming when i need to take into account the string attaching the two masses. Is my logic correct thus far?
W=P.Ef-P.Ei=K.Ef-K.Ei.
I don't know much about strings...But I am trying my best gathering resources that help..
Sometimes:
E.P.E=K.E
 
Hmm not sure that helps me a ton unfortunately.. i am reallly struggling to wrap my head around this potential energy problem.
 

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