Launching an object into OUTER space

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the feasibility of launching a small object (approximately 5kg) into outer space, specifically addressing the physical challenges, budget considerations, and potential methods for achieving this goal. Participants explore various aspects of rocketry, including altitude, velocity, and the technological requirements involved in such a launch.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants argue that launching an object into space is not feasible without a budget of several hundred thousand to several million dollars, citing the costs associated with rocket construction and fuel.
  • Others question the feasibility of using a helium balloon to lift a rocket to a certain altitude before launch, seeking clarification on the challenges this approach might face.
  • A few participants highlight the distinction between reaching 100km altitude and achieving orbit, emphasizing the need for significant velocity to escape Earth's gravitational pull.
  • One participant mentions Tsiolkovsky's rocket equation as a tool to understand the propellant mass and exhaust velocity needed for such a launch.
  • Concerns are raised about the engineering challenges involved, with one participant suggesting that the original poster may not fully grasp the complexities of rocketry.
  • Another participant notes that the rocket's propellant must constitute a large percentage of the rocket's total mass, which could significantly increase the size and complexity of the design.
  • Some participants draw comparisons between rockets and planes, pointing out the fundamental differences in propulsion methods and the implications for reaching space.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally disagree on the feasibility and budget required for launching an object into space. While some assert that it is impossible without substantial funding, others explore alternative methods and express a willingness to learn about the challenges involved. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the practicality of the proposed ideas.

Contextual Notes

Participants express varying levels of understanding regarding the physics and engineering challenges of space launches, with some acknowledging their limited knowledge and seeking clarification. The discussion includes references to specific rocket designs and their capabilities, but no consensus is reached on the feasibility of the original proposal.

  • #31
About Earth's Escape Velocity; the place I have the problem is when I jump, I'm clearly not traveling at 11.2km/s and yet I'm escaping the Earth's gravity - although very slowly and for an extremely short time.

When a rocket is 20km above ground the escape velocity should be less since it's farther from Earth. So why does the rocket need to be traveling 11.2km/s.

On another note, that speed is so fast that I'm doubting my understanding of maths and measurements. Does 11.2km/s really mean 11.2 kilometres a second. That is unbelievably fast, especially in a direct upward direction!
 
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  • #32
mrxyz said:
About Earth's Escape Velocity; the place I have the problem is when I jump, I'm clearly not traveling at 11.2km/s and yet I'm escaping the Earth's gravity - although very slowly and for an extremely short time.

No, you most emphatically are NOT escaping Earth's gravity. Like much of the rest of your discussion, this just points to your ignorance of the fundamentals. I do not say this to be rude, but if you want to swim in the deep end of the pool you need to know how to do more than just splash around and make noise.

When a rocket is 20km above ground the escape velocity should be less since it's farther from Earth. So why does the rocket need to be traveling 11.2km/s.

Look up the radius of the Earth and figure out what % your have changed your height when you add 20km. Again, you are simply missing the basics.

On another note, that speed is so fast that I'm doubting my understanding of maths and measurements. Does 11.2km/s really mean 11.2 kilometres a second. That is unbelievably fast, especially in a direct upward direction!

yes
 
  • #33
About Earth's Escape Velocity; the place I have the problem is when I jump, I'm clearly not traveling at 11.2km/s and yet I'm escaping the Earth's gravity - although very slowly and for an extremely short time.

When a rocket is 20km above ground the escape velocity should be less since it's farther from Earth. So why does the rocket need to be traveling 11.2km/s.

On another note, that speed is so fast that I'm doubting my understanding of maths and measurements. Does 11.2km/s really mean 11.2 kilometres a second. That is unbelievably fast, especially in a direct upward direction!
Escape velocity is the V0 of an object at ground level. With this initial velocity and no other acceleration but gravity, it'll reach infinity and stop there. You certainly can't do that with jumping.

Km/s is right.
Compare Earth's orbital speed around the Sun(30km/s) or Solar system's orbital speed around the galactic centre(~250km/s). These are the kinds of velocities you encounter in outer space.
 
  • #34
Bandersnatch said:
Escape velocity is the V0 of an object at ground level. With this initial velocity and no other acceleration but gravity, it'll reach infinity and stop there. You certainly can't do that with jumping.

Km/s is right.
Compare Earth's orbital speed around the Sun(30km/s) or Solar system's orbital speed around the galactic centre(~250km/s). These are the kinds of velocities you encounter in outer space.

That was helpful, thanks :)
 
  • #35
This thread has been sufficiently answered. It has gone severely off-topic, so this is locked.
 
  • #36
mrxyz said:
Like I said, I've seen it having an effect on people I've known throughout college causing them to dropout because they thought they were incapable of studying complex subjects such as these. And in some cases making them settle with a simple, unsatisfying, undemanding and low paying jobs.

And other than that, decrease interest in physics/science causing less people to take it as a study option, making further research and breakthroughs in the field slower.

That's why.

Learning physics requires a good amount of humility and patience, and in my experience, most humans find those things difficult.

Breakthroughs are happening all the time. The pace of research is mostly set by money - qualified applicants are rarely the limiting factor.
 
  • #37
Folks need to take a deep breath and chill - and stop with the personal remarks.

PF guidelines are quite clear -
https://www.physicsforums.com/showthread.php?t=414380

"If you choose to post a response, address only the substantive content, constructively, and ignore any personal remarks." In other words, please avoid making personal statements about members, and avoid 'you' statements.

If one takes exception to a post, then please report it using the [Report] button.
 

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