Learning Integrals with the Graph of y=x^2

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around understanding integrals using the graph of the function y = x². Participants explore fundamental concepts of integration, including the interpretation of dx, the area under the curve, and the relationship between a function and its derivative. The scope includes conceptual clarification and mathematical reasoning.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant asks if dx represents the small distance between vertical lines on the graph, suggesting it is very small.
  • Another participant clarifies that f(x) * dx approximates the area of a rectangle under the curve, indicating that as dx decreases, the approximation improves.
  • Participants agree that the integral from 0 to 2 of x² represents the total area under the curve, which includes the yellow area discussed.
  • There is a discussion about the blue line being the tangent to the curve, with some participants noting that it touches rather than crosses the curve at specific points.
  • One participant mentions that the derivative gives the slope of the tangent line, but the constant term must also be determined to fully describe the tangent line's equation.
  • Another participant points out that the term "gradient" is used in different contexts, particularly in functions of multiple variables, and explains its meaning in that context.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the interpretations of dx, the area under the curve, and the nature of the tangent line. However, there are nuances in the understanding of the tangent line's equation and the terminology used, indicating some level of disagreement or uncertainty.

Contextual Notes

Some participants express uncertainty about the terminology, such as the use of "dx" versus "Δx," and the implications of the tangent line's equation, which may depend on the specific context of the discussion.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be useful for individuals studying calculus, particularly those seeking to understand the foundational concepts of integration and the relationship between functions and their derivatives.

Stephanus
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Dear PF Forum,
I'd like to study integral.
But I just realize that I'm lack of basic integral.
Can I ask here?
Let y=x2
Here is the graph.
mike1.2.jpg

So,
1. dx is the distance between the red vertical lines? But it's very, very, very small distance.
2. f(x) * dx is the yellow area?
3. ##\int_0^2 x^2\,dx## is the green (plus yellow) area?
4. And one more thing. The blue line function can be derived from the derivative of f(x)?
For example the derivative of x2 is 2x. So a line that crosses (x,f(x)) where x=1 is 2.
The blue line function is y = 2x.
If it crosses (x,f(x)) where x = 2, then the blue line function is y = 4x?
Thank you very much
 
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Stephanus said:
Dear PF Forum,
I'd like to study integral.
But I just realize that I'm lack of basic integral.
Can I ask here?
Let y=x2
Here is the graph.
View attachment 108202
So,
1. dx is the distance between the red vertical lines? But it's very, very, very small distance.
We usually call this ##\Delta x##.
Stephanus said:
2. f(x) * dx is the yellow area?
If ##x_i## is a number in the subinterval at the base of the yellow region, then ##f(x_i)\Delta x## is the area of a rectangle that is approximately equal to the area of the yellow region. The smaller the value of ##\Delta x##, the better the approximation is. Here we are approximating a roughly trapezoidal shape by one with a rectangular shape.
Stephanus said:
3. ##\int_0^2 x^2\,dx## is the green (plus yellow) area?
Yes
Stephanus said:
4. And one more thing. The blue line function can be derived from the derivative of f(x)?
For example the derivative of x2 is 2x. So a line that crosses (x,f(x)) where x=1 is 2.
The blue line doesn't "cross" the curve -- it touches it at the point of tangency.
Stephanus said:
The blue line function is y = 2x.
If it crosses (x,f(x)) where x = 2, then the blue line function is y = 4x?
No. The slope of the tangent line (what you're calling the blue line) is 4, but if you draw this line you'll see that the tangent line intersects the y-axis below the origin. The line whose slope is 4, that is tangent to the graph of y = x2 at (2, 4), has this equation: y = 4x - 4.
 
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EDIT: Sorry. I took a break before submitting and this is mostly a repeat of @Mark44's answer above.
Stephanus said:
1. dx is the distance between the red vertical lines? But it's very, very, very small distance.
Yes.
2. f(x) * dx is the yellow area?
Yes. But there is a small range of x values in that short dx, so you pick one, say x0, in that range and use f(x0)) * dx as the approximation of the yellow area. As dx gets smaller, the approximation gets better.
3. ##\int_0^2 x^2\,dx## is the green (plus yellow) area?
Yes.
4. And one more thing. The blue line function can be derived from the derivative of f(x)?
The derivative f(x0) only gives you the slope of the line tangent at x0. So figuring out the constant term of the line is still required.
For example the derivative of x2 is 2x. So a line that crosses (x,f(x)) where x=1 is 2.
Except for the constant. In general, the equation of the tangent line is f'(x0) * (x-x0) + f(x0)
 
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Mark44 said:
We usually call this ##\Delta x##.
Yes, I think it's just semantic here. I usually see f(u) du or F(v) dv.
But delta is more appropriate I think. The difference, right?
Thanks.
Mark44 said:
If ##x_i## is a number in the subinterval at the base of the yellow region, then ##f(x_i)\Delta x## is the area of a rectangle that is approximately equal to the area of the yellow region. The smaller the value of ##\Delta x##, the better the approximation is. Here we are approximating a roughly trapezoidal shape by one with a rectangular shape.
Trapezoidal shape looks very similar to rectangle. Thanks.
Mark44 said:
Stephanus said:
3. ##\int_0^2 x^2\,dx## is the green (plus yellow) area?
Yes
Thanks
Mark44 said:
The blue line doesn't "cross" the curve -- it touches it at the point of tangency.
Yes, I should have drawn it more clearly. What I was going to draw is that the blue line did touch the curve. It touches not crosses. Thanks
Mark44 said:
No. The slope of the tangent line (what you're calling the blue line) is 4, but if you draw this line you'll see that the tangent line intersects the y-axis below the origin. The line whose slope is 4, that is tangent to the graph of y = x2 at (2, 4), has this equation: y = 4x - 4.
Yes, I should have drawn it below the origin. Thanks. So it is slope? In high school we call it gradient.

Now I can at least read any reference about integration.
THanks.
 
Thanks @FactChecker . I suspect that all the answer should be yes. But I need confirmation. I'm going to read some calculus source. Thanks.
 
Stephanus said:
Thanks. So it is slope? In high school we call it gradient.
Here the meanings are the same, but the term "gradient" is also used in functions of two or more variables, and in that context, the gradient of f (denoted ##\nabla f##) is a vector that consists of the partial derivatives of f. For example, for a function f(x, y, z), ##\nabla f## is the vector ## <\frac{\partial f}{\partial x}, \frac{\partial f}{\partial y}, \frac{\partial f}{\partial z}>## .
 
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Mark44 said:
the gradient of f (denoted ##\nabla f##) is a vector that consists of the partial derivatives of f.
I would only add that the gradient vector points in the direction of fastest increase of the function and its magnitude is the slope in that direction.
 

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