Legitimacy of ADD/ADHD (scientific discussion)

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  • #26
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Ok so if I understand your argument correctly you mean that the danger with a drug such as ritalin is that it will be used with the wrong purposes. Which is what happens sometimes, since it regulates dopamine, which is a feel good hormone it can give you a buzz if you take enough. However that is also why the drug is so controlled and why every time you want to get your ritalin from the pharmacy you need a new prescription (the original). This makes your comparison of ritalin to something you can easily buy such as a knife wrong.

No it should be controlled. I absolutely agree. The analogy was merely to attack the bandwagon that people use to justify their opinion of eliminating a product. In fact, I was agreeing with you that people bring it to themselves. And like knives, it ultimately comes down to how it is used.
 
  • #27
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Yes and sharp pocket knives are sold for 1 dollar at Walmart (just saw a vicious looking one the other day at least). I always despise the danger argument because it always falls down to how it is used--which is largely out of our control.

There are sufficiently few stabbings compared to drug abuse. In my town, a crime is about 400 times more likely to be drug-abuse related than assault-related based on yearly averages.
 
  • #28
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There are sufficiently few stabbings compared to drug abuse. In my town, a crime is about 400 times more likely to be drug-abuse related than assault-related based on yearly averages.

I'm having trouble reading between the lines in your statement. Are you disagreeing with me, if so, what exactly?
 
  • #29
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I think everyone was agreeing with everyone, but we didn't phrase our arguments in a way that everyone could understand. The analogy might have caused a bit of confusion though.
 
  • #30
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I think everyone was agreeing with everyone, but we didn't phrase our arguments in a way that everyone could understand. The analogy might have caused a bit of confusion though.

Haha, my apology-- I should have added a bit more context to it.

Anyways,

Just want to add to that, that it has been shown that leaving ADHD children un-medicated can result in them feeling inferior and hopeless. This can lead to reckless behaviour and the use of drugs. Anyway ritalin is one of the most tested drugs on the market and has very few side effects. Thus the positives out weighs the negatives. However ADHD can also be brought on by drugs and society (such as addiction to social networks) in these cases I believe the people can bring it upon themselves.

On the other side, medicating children can leave them too dependent on the medication instead of focusing on discipline and overcoming the social obstacle themselves. In addition, children who are medicated may feel inferior due to the "ADD" label that often comes with a negative connotation. To add even more dismay, children often seem to grow out of the "ADD" symptoms as they age.

What a complex and ambiguous world we live in.

I know for a fact that I would have been diagnosed with ADHD if examined as a child. I don't really know if I still have it, but one thing for sure--I think I greatly benefited from attributing my ADD symptoms solely to mind-set and habits (I didn't even believe in ADD). And as a result, I feel that I became much more disciplined.
 
  • #31
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You make a great point, if you can overcome your ADHD without medication that is great, your mindset obviously makes a big difference and people do become dependent on the medication, I would say that I am. However for some this is much better than the alternative. I mean most people who take concerto are prime examples. Concerto's effect lasts for up to twelve hour. For some people the problem far exceed not being able to concentrate in class. They even have trouble speaking to people because of their short attentions spans.
 
  • #32
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You make a great point, if you can overcome your ADHD without medication that is great, your mindset obviously makes a big difference and people do become dependent on the medication, I would say that I am. However for some this is much better than the alternative. I mean most people who take concerto are prime examples. Concerto's effect lasts for up to twelve hour. For some people the problem far exceed not being able to concentrate in class. They even have trouble speaking to people because of their short attentions spans.

Can you detail me in on the exam that diagnosed you with ADHD by the way? I've always wondered how accurate the tests are at diagnosing someone.
 
  • #33
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I'm having trouble reading between the lines in your statement. Are you disagreeing with me, if so, what exactly?

I am not making any value judgments, I just think knifes was a poor analogy to drugs from a policy-making perspective.
 
  • #34
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I am not making any value judgments, I just think knifes was a poor analogy to drugs from a policy-making perspective.

I think its a great analogy, knives have the potential to do much more harm. And the whole point is, whatever the regulation, there will always be ways to abuse things. Just as there will always be ways to abuse things that are not regulated.

Knives can kill, but are open to the market. Why should brain enhancements be policed and not knives? I believe it should be a human right to be able to enhance one's brain dynamics as he/she sees fit.

If you argue that some brain enhancers are abused for x,y,z, then you should note that other commonly used medication are also abused.

If you argue that using certain brain enhancers is cheating, then I point that cheating is just a word that accounts to what is not of the norm. If one person opened his textbook in the middle of class, then he would be cheating. But if it was an open-book test and everyone used the book, then it isn't cheating. Likewise, if everyone had access to brain enhancers, then it wouldn't be cheating.

I think if you are old enough to make your own informed decision, then why not? You don't see things such as processed food, alcohol, or x,y,z being monitored.

And I don't expect you to agree, I'm just disagreeing with your statement =p. Though it is an interesting topic, the discussion of regulation is a pretty big one nowadays. For example, who gets to have ownership over parts of the moon, should 3d printers be regulated, etc.
 
  • #35
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There is an evaluation test that I did when I was small but the details of this is very hazy as it was so long ago. The best way to evaluate someone's mental state is to have them talk to a psychologist. I don't know the details of how exactly they evaluate you either though. The thing is there isn't a full proof way of diagnosing some disorders, its not like testing for a virus where you either have it or not, it depends on to what extent you have ADHD, which is also why ritalin comes in all kinds of forms and doses.
 
  • #36
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So, is ADD 'real'? Is it overdiagnosed?
There are some diseases where the therapy is developed before a medical diagnostic test was available. There are other diseases where the medical diagnostic test was developed before a therapy was available. I don't know of any disease where both were developed at the same time.

ADD is the of the former type, there is a therapy, but no medical diagnostic test. So there is no doubt that once we do develop a medical diagnostic test we will find that we are currently treating many patients who do not have the underlying medical condition and that we are not treating many patients who do. Such is the nature of any therapy without a medical diagnostic test (and many therapies with a test).

There is at this time no way to determine if a given individual fits into the "over-diagnosed" or "under-treated" category.
 
  • #37
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Actually I just thought of a possible way it can be medically shown that someone has ADHD at least one type of it anyway. One symptom is that concentration is broken when to much pressure is applied on the act of concentration. This can be overcome by use of adrenalin. Thus it should be possible to observe these changes in an MRI scanner.
 

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