Lennard Jones, 3 particles, partition function

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around calculating the average inter-particle distance of three particles interacting via Lennard-Jones potentials. Participants explore the formulation of the partition function and the challenges associated with integrating over the particle positions.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant outlines the total potential for three particles and attempts to express the partition function as a triple integral over particle positions.
  • Another participant suggests that the new coordinates will introduce an additional constraint, requiring integration over two independent relative positions and the center of mass.
  • There is uncertainty about how to rewrite the integral in terms of inter-particle distances, particularly with more than two particles involved.
  • One participant expresses concern that the integral may be intractable due to the dependence of the potential on the distance between the third particle and the others.
  • A later reply indicates a shift towards using particle simulation as a practical solution to the problem, rather than pursuing analytical methods.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the best approach to simplify the partition function or the feasibility of the integral. Multiple competing views on the integration method and the potential complexity remain unresolved.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include the introduction of additional constraints in the coordinate transformation and the potential for infinite volume integrals when considering the center of mass. The discussion highlights the challenges of handling integrals involving more than two particles.

SchroedingersLion
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TL;DR
Calculation of canonical integrals for 3 Lennard Jones particles.
Greetings,

similar to my previous thread
(https://www.physicsforums.com/threa...ce-between-two-particles.990055/#post-6355442),
I am trying to calculate the average inter-particle distance of particles that interact via Lennard Jones potentials. Now, however, I am dealing with 3 particles, and I fail to write down the partition function in a way that allows (numerical) computation.

The total potential is given by ##\hat{U}(\mathbf{q_1}, \mathbf{q_2}, \mathbf{q_3})=U(r_{1,2})+U(r_{1,3})+U(r_{2,3})## with ##\mathbf{q_i}## the position of particle ##i##, ##r_{i,j}## the distance between particles ##i## and ##j##, and ##U(r)## the usual Lennard Jones potential.

The partition function can then be written as $$Z=\int_{R³}\int_{R³}\int_{R³}e^{-\beta U(r_{1,2})}e^{-\beta U(r_{1,3})}e^{-\beta U(r_{1,3})}d³\mathbf{q_1}d³\mathbf{q_2}d³\mathbf{q_3}$$ I assume there is again a convenient way to transform this to a simpler integral as the potential only depends on the three inter-particle distances.
Can I again simply go to the coordinates ##\mathbf{R}=\frac 1 3 (\mathbf{q_1}+\mathbf{q_2}+\mathbf{q_3})## and ##\mathbf{r_{i,j}}=\mathbf{r_i}-\mathbf{r_j}##?
(@vanhees71 's approach in my previous thread to two particles where it worked fine).

But this does not seem to do the trick, as I would arrive at a 12-dimensional integral, instead of a 9-dimensional integral.SL
 
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So far as the calculus is concerned your new coordinates (plus R) will have an additional vector constraint. Defining the COM relative vector positions as: \mathbf{r}_k = \mathbf{q}_k -\mathbf{R} means they will satisfy:
\sum_{k=1}^3 \mathbf{r}_k = 0
So for example you would, say, integrate over \mathbf{R}, \mathbf{r}_1, and \mathbf{r}_2 and express the third position as a function of the two you chose to be independent.

As to the physics. The integration over \mathbf{R} would decouple but yield an infinite volume integral. But that's just the failure to recognize that in a practical setting one would be confining the entire system within a finite volume to regularize it. One can factor out this contribution, I believe, and simply renormalize the partition function.
 
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jambaugh said:
So far as the calculus is concerned your new coordinates (plus R) will have an additional vector constraint. Defining the COM relative vector positions as: \mathbf{r}_k = \mathbf{q}_k -\mathbf{R} means they will satisfy:
\sum_{k=1}^3 \mathbf{r}_k = 0
So for example you would, say, integrate over \mathbf{R}, \mathbf{r}_1, and \mathbf{r}_2 and express the third position as a function of the two you chose to be independent.

Thank you! While I understand your substitution, I am not sure how that leads to an integration over the ##r_{i,j}## from my OP. Then again, I am not sure that it is even possible to rewrite the integral in my desired form with more than two particles.
 
My inclination is to work relative to one of the particles, say the first and integrate over \mathbf{r}_{12} and \mathbf{r}_{13} using \mathbf{r}_{23} = \mathbf{r}_{13}-\mathbf{r}_{12}.

Still, I'm inclined to think that the integral is going to be nasty (intractable) due to the dependence of the potential on \lVert \mathbf{r}_{23}\rVert.
 
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Cheers,

I will probably not spend further time on this then, and instead "solve" the problem by using a particle simulation with very small step size.
 

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