Light ray paths near schwarzschild blackhole

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around simulating light ray paths near Schwarzschild black holes, with participants exploring the equations and methods necessary for plotting these trajectories. The conversation includes aspects of theoretical physics, mathematical reasoning, and computational approaches, with a focus on both the mathematical underpinnings and practical implementation in programming.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Homework-related

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses interest in simulating light ray paths near black holes, specifically starting with Schwarzschild black holes.
  • Another participant suggests reviewing Lagrangian mechanics as a potential starting point.
  • Several participants share links to papers and resources that may help in understanding the physics involved.
  • There is a discussion about the difference between plotting the trajectory of a photon on a coordinate map versus what an observer would see, with some noting that the latter is more complex.
  • Participants discuss the equations related to geodesics, including the impact parameter and deflection angle in the Schwarzschild metric.
  • One participant mentions the effective potential in the Schwarzschild metric and questions whether it can be used to plot trajectories for both photons and observers.
  • A participant shares Python code that calculates the deflection of a light ray grazing the sun, indicating a practical approach to the problem.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the interest in simulating light ray paths and the relevance of geodesics, but there are varying opinions on the complexity of different aspects of the simulation, particularly regarding what an observer would see versus plotting photon trajectories. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the best methods and equations to use.

Contextual Notes

Participants express uncertainty about the implementation of certain equations and the conditions under which they apply, particularly in relation to numerical integration methods and the effective potential. There are also mentions of the challenges in differentiating equations for computational purposes.

  • #31
nocks said:
That would be

\frac{d^2r}{d\lambda^2} = - \frac{L^2(3M-r)}{r^4}

Which gives me the closest radius for a stable orbit of a photon as 3M

Reduce this second-order equation to two first-order equations by setting p = dr/d\lambda, so that dp/dt = d^2r/d\lambda^2. The set of equations that describes the worldline of a photon then is

<br /> \begin{equation*}<br /> \begin{split}<br /> \frac{d \phi}{d \lambda} &amp;= \frac{L}{r^2} \\<br /> \frac{dr}{d\lambda} &amp;= p \\<br /> \frac{dp}{d \lambda} &amp;= \frac{L^2(r - 3M)}{r^4}.\\<br /> \end{split}<br /> \end{equation*}<br />

Assuming that all required values are given, write a few lines of (pseudo)code that uses the simplest, most intuitive method (Euler's method) to solve these equations.
 
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  • #32
Having a bit of trouble with this but I have p as

p = \frac{L^2(2M-r)}{2r^3}
 
  • #33
wow it's been a while since I looked at this project.
Thought i'd come back to it :)

George Jones said:
Reduce this second-order equation to two first-order equations by setting p = dr/d\lambda, so that dp/dt = d^2r/d\lambda^2. The set of equations that describes the worldline of a photon then is

<br /> \begin{equation*}<br /> \begin{split}<br /> \frac{d \phi}{d \lambda} &amp;= \frac{L}{r^2} \\<br /> \frac{dr}{d\lambda} &amp;= p \\<br /> \frac{dp}{d \lambda} &amp;= \frac{L^2(r - 3M)}{r^4}.\\<br /> \end{split}<br /> \end{equation*}<br />

Assuming that all required values are given, write a few lines of (pseudo)code that uses the simplest, most intuitive method (Euler's method) to solve these equations.
A few questions. Since I lack a good maths background, I would appreciate some advice on how I would implement these 3 equations into a numerical solver like Euler's or Runge-Kutta to get back some results that I could plot.
e.g. Do I pre-define L?, how do I know which direction the photon is travelling?

currently trying to use this : http://www.ee.ucl.ac.uk/~mflanaga/java/RungeKutta.html
 
Last edited:

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