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B Magnetic levitation with permanent magnets

  1. Jul 18, 2017 #1
    so i am literally one step away from producing a floating skateboard powered by permanent magnets,
    so here's what i wanted to check, to make sure I haven't missed anything obvious

    vertical lift achieved by using vertical repelling fields
    rotational motion is controlled by counterbalancing the magnets desire to flip over and attract
    Lateral motion controlled by radial magnets
    essentially the magnets cant move down, cant flip over and cant move sideways or backwards or forwards, thus leaving the magnet array stationary and suspended.
     
  2. jcsd
  3. Jul 18, 2017 #2

    sophiecentaur

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    You have missed the other degrees of freedom. Try the same thing on a glass plate, at various heights above the plane of the ring of magnets. Try it without restraining the test magnet's orientation. A hover board hovers. Any magnet will repel upwards is you stop it flipping.
     
  4. Jul 18, 2017 #3

    Vanadium 50

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    And you'll be one step away forever, I'm afraid. I know you don't believe in Earnshaw's theorem, but it's still a theorem.
     
  5. Jul 18, 2017 #4

    berkeman

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  6. Jul 18, 2017 #5
    thats what the one step away is, getting quotes to have the magnets needed engineered, the requirements are proving costly
     
  7. Jul 18, 2017 #6
  8. Jul 18, 2017 #7
    if and only if this last part doesnt work, with the dimensions it requires to work, then i will give up and move onto electromagnets :)
     
  9. Jul 18, 2017 #8

    berkeman

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    One of the most important lessons I've learned in my very creative and productive engineering career is to look for "non-existence proofs" that can help to keep me from going down an unproductive rabbit hole for way too long in trying to invent something or solve a problem.

    I guess a part of that is having enough of a technical background to understand the counterarguments and non-existence proofs. What is your technical background? Do you understand the calculus in the link that I posted? One of the most important reasons that I have the great patents that I have is because I cut short the paths that I was investigating that I found out early-on had valid non-existence proofs, and concentrated my work on the other possible paths.

    And BTW, the whole "hoverboard" thing requires a surface to generate a repelling force against, so unless you plan on coating bikepaths with diamagnetic materials, that will probably not be practical, IMO.

    Keep on being creative and working on good stuff, but think about more education and more emphasis on early non-existence proof detection. :smile:
     
  10. Jul 19, 2017 #9
    your thinking is a little too literal for me, i would have to be an absolute idiot to think i could make something repel away from the earth, but to have something repel away from a different kind of surface such as a skateboard that can have a means of repulsion attached to it isnt the thinking of an absolute idiot, why coat bike paths when skateboards can quite happily go along them.
     
  11. Jul 19, 2017 #10

    sophiecentaur

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    So you wold suspend a overboard over a skateboard? To what end
     
  12. Jul 19, 2017 #11
    well, for a start once the lift to weight ratio has been solved the board could support somones weight, with the lateral motion being controlled the person could propel themselves forward in the same way as a conventional board is used, and lastly magnetic fields move in a very similar way to water, this would create a feeling of riding on a liquid. but mainly cause it would be fun
     
  13. Jul 19, 2017 #12

    sophiecentaur

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    Ahh. :smile:
     
  14. Jul 20, 2017 #13

    mfb

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    Do you have a sketch of the proposed setup?

    If your arrangement has only permanent magnets, then your levitating magnet has to be supported in at least one degree of freedom, it has to move constantly, or it has to rotate. Otherwise it cannot be stable. This is a very fundamental theorem and it applies to all possible magnet configurations.
     
  15. Jul 20, 2017 #14
    the only thing i have at the moment are renders of the concept, which i have included in this reply, , as far as the stability of the floating board, i have the vertical lift sorted, i have the rotational aspect sorted and i have the lateral control sorted, as i said in an earlier post, i am talking to companies about getting the final magnets engineered, their height is causing major issues, but all potential problems as far as preventing the magnets from attracting has been taken into account full board 2.jpg Full Board 03.jpg full board.jpg halbach array to surround Vert Post.jpg RENDER 1 OF MAGBOARD.jpg RENDER 2 OF MAGBOARD.jpg
     
  16. Jul 20, 2017 #15

    mfb

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    Ah, it is supported at both ends.

    I would expect that there are easier ways to make a "soft" board, but it looks like an interesting concept.
     
  17. Jul 20, 2017 #16

    sophiecentaur

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    Spring suspension, comes to mind. I would expect a skateboarder to want a better feel of contact with the ground than a soggy suspension, though. Certainly for tricks.
     
  18. Jul 20, 2017 #17

    Vanadium 50

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    So what exactly is levitating?
     
  19. Jul 20, 2017 #18

    berkeman

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    I was thinking springs as well.

    @Mack7963 -- Beautiful work. You could win an Industrial Design award with that kind of work. I don't think the magnet thing will work out for you, but you have a lot of talent in Industrial Design. :smile:
     
  20. Jul 20, 2017 #19
    the top board
     
  21. Jul 20, 2017 #20
    i will take that complement about the design and pay for it with thanks, at this stage its no longer about if it will work or not, now its about getting it to that point where my own eyes see the end result, and above all else its been a learning experience, i know more about magnets now than i did 6 years ago, so even IF it fails, i still walk away from this as a winner......just not a rich one :)
     
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