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Complaint Mainstream science criterion

  1. Nov 4, 2009 #1

    turin

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    Can we remove the mainstream science criterion, or at least be much less strict about it. I have seen a few times now threads that I thought were interesting, but then disappointingly closed because they rubbed a mentor in a non-mainstream way. Is this forum to be restricted to mere factual reference?
     
  2. jcsd
  3. Nov 4, 2009 #2

    dx

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    Can you link to a few of these closed threads? Just curious.
     
  4. Nov 4, 2009 #3

    turin

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    I realize that these kinds of discussions are unpopular and frustrating, and that they have the potential to turn away some valuable people. But, there are others (myself included) who are disappointed. Here is the most recent one that I've seen, which prompted me to post here.

    https://www.physicsforums.com/showthread.php?t=350472
     
  5. Nov 4, 2009 #4

    DaveC426913

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    This forum has a mandate to educate students with discussion about existing science theories. It cannot be all things to all people. There are plenty of fora out there that will welcome highly speculative threads.
     
  6. Nov 4, 2009 #5

    russ_watters

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    That thread was basically wrong-headed idle speculation and trolling. There isn't much to be gained from a discussion where the person driving the discussion is just pulling factually wrong claims out of the air and posting them without thought. From your first post:
    I'm not completely sure what you meant by that, but all discussions must, at least, be grounded in reality and logic. If you are asking that we allow pure, baseless idle speculation, sorry, but that isn't going to happen here.
     
  7. Nov 6, 2009 #6
    Ok, I came here to give a suggestion and found a thread that speaks about me, good to hear that.

    Listen russ_watters you can abuse someone and make general comments about somebody without being specific about it, and then can be happy about it. But this is what the papal's do, they do not try to be specific and tell what exactly is wrong, they just brand a person heretic and excommunicate him.

    Anyways, I think one additional purpose of such forum's is to make money or sell themselves. So what you can do, and do it very safely is start a new section by the name non-mainstream where those restrictions do not apply as much.

    I suggest this because if you see the number of hits my thread got was really very high for those 3-4 days, it crossed over 1000 in just 4 days.

    Think about it!
     
    Last edited: Nov 6, 2009
  8. Nov 6, 2009 #7

    Pengwuino

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    There is the independent research area which, if it still is around, gets (got) out of control with crackpottery.
     
  9. Nov 6, 2009 #8

    ZapperZ

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    We HAD that, it was a disaster!

    PF has had a "long" history in its evolution. Your suggestion isn't something we haven't tried before. Furthermore, there are so many other forums that cater to crackpottery ... er... non-mainstream posts. Knock yourself out there. Why pick the one few forums that simply don't welcome them? You did read the Rules when you signed up, so you should know fully well what you were getting yourself into, don't you?

    This forum has a very high signal-to-noise ratio. It is the major selling point of this forum that made us popular in the first place.

    Zz.
     
  10. Nov 6, 2009 #9

    arildno

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    First off:
    Somehow, I think you could have done better with the mutual recriminations between the Shias and Sunnis in, for example, contemporary Yemen, rather than denounce how papal power was wielded centuries ago.

    Secondly:
    Your analogy is totally wrong, since PF and its staff has no means of coercion available OTHER THAN shutting an individual out of PF.
    In contrast to what sort of powers the Pope possessed, and various religious communities still possess, along with most state authorities.

    Thus, a PROPER analogy would have been:
    Can a private individual shut somebody else out from his own home merely on basis that the guest is voicing views the house owner doesn't like?

    Of course the house owner can do so!

    You are free to go wherever you like, but individual sites possess the right to kick you out of their home turf.
     
  11. Nov 6, 2009 #10

    jtbell

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    The Independent Research forum still exists. Look under General Physics. It doesn't get much traffic because it's moderated, with specific requirements for the format and contents of initial posts.

    About three years ago (I think), the IR forum replaced a forum called "Theory Development" which was unmoderated and overrun with crackpottery. This is what Zz was referring to with his "We HAD that" statement.
     
  12. Nov 6, 2009 #11

    turin

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    Why did you need to shut down the forum if it was already sequestered? Was it simply consuming too much physical bandwidth or storage space, and so causing the rest of the forums to suffer? It seems like, without a designated area, the crackpots are infecting all areas.
     
  13. Nov 6, 2009 #12

    Evo

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    This forum doesn't host discussions on crackpot ideas or conspiracy theories. There are many, many places on the internet that do if you enjoy that type of thing.
     
  14. Nov 6, 2009 #13

    turin

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    Actually, it does. Just not for very long.
     
  15. Nov 6, 2009 #14

    arildno

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    Totally wrong!

    By not giving them ANY platform, they wail and scream, and then..LEAVE. For good.

    Did you ever think they kept themselves within the designated area? :rofl:
     
  16. Nov 6, 2009 #15

    turin

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    This is exactly what I'm talking about. Your response is totally inappropriate. What, exactly, is "totally wrong"? Asking a question?

    I appologize (insincerely) for not knowing the answer to my own question before I asked it.
     
  17. Nov 6, 2009 #16

    arildno

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    It was a response to the your last assertion:
    Having a designated crackpot area attracts them in large numbers, making crackpottery more visible, not only in the designated area, but in many other sub-forums as well.

    By refusing their "right to have their own place at PF" dissuades many of them from even visiting (much less commenting), so that their "attack strength" becomes minimized.
     
  18. Nov 6, 2009 #17

    Moonbear

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    So, in your first post you were complaining that the rules against crackpottery are overly strict and should be relaxed, and now here you're complaining that the crackpots are infesting all areas of the forum. Do you see the logical inconsistency in those two arguments?
     
  19. Nov 6, 2009 #18

    Astronuc

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    Crackpots come here with an agenda. Also, it appears that most do not read the PF guidelines, or if they do, simply disregard them.

    IR is set up for independent (non-mainstream) research. A big problem is that most submitters do not bother to follow the submission guidelines, assuming that they even bother to read them in the first place.

    We get a lot of ill-informed people there, who feel they understand physics or the ultimate reality, when in fact they express a poor understanding of basics.

    It is way too much effort to monitor each and every post for misinformation of crackpots, so if we find a post or thread, it is shutdown pretty quickly.

    And we certainly do not need a crackpot forum at PF.
     
  20. Nov 7, 2009 #19

    Redbelly98

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    We are not trying to make money at PF. We are trying to teach and discuss the current knowledge of science, math, and technology. That is what attracts most of our members here.

    Allowing personal theories ends up, in many cases, consuming members' time with trying to teach basic stuff to somebody who does not wish to learn or understand it. (And learning the basics is necessary before developing a new theory.) Our general membership finds this extremely annoying, so we don't allow it.
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2009
  21. Nov 7, 2009 #20

    arildno

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    Furthermore, keeping the house clean increases the chances that people we want to visit PF choose to do so.

    For example, professional engineers and other scientists will often have low tolerance for "garbage", and will keep away from sites they see allow garbage proliferation.
     
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