Movies for hardcore sci-fi geeks

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The discussion highlights several notable independent science fiction films, with a particular focus on "Primer," a low-budget film that explores complex themes of time travel and causality. Despite its intricate plot, which some find confusing, it has garnered a cult following and critical acclaim, including the Grand Jury Prize at Sundance. Other films mentioned include "Metropolis," "Solaris," "Brazil," "The Man from Earth," and "A Scanner Darkly," with varying opinions on their narrative depth and adaptation quality. The conversation also touches on the merits of character-driven storytelling, as seen in "Firefly," and critiques the reliance on special effects in modern cinema, advocating for narratives that prioritize strong writing and conceptual originality. The participants express a preference for science fiction that adheres to realistic scientific principles, contrasting it with fantasy elements that can detract from the genre's integrity. Overall, the thread emphasizes the value of thoughtful storytelling in science fiction, regardless of budget or mainstream success.
  • #61


Westworld.

Hardly the best movie I have seen, but as a teenager I was great fan of The Magnificent Seven, so any movie staring Yul Brynner was a must to see.
 
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  • #62


wencke530 said:
Dune, anyone?

My wife still makes fun of me for owning this movie. The novel is much better than the movie, though.

Yes, only the original movie though. The more recent ones were kinda cheesy(er).
 
  • #63


Hah! This is part 1 of the release of Metropolis that I was referencing. Be sure to check it out. I think this is one of the great movies of all time - an absolute masterpiece; and imo, even more so with the additions from Moroder. When I first saw this, I literally had to watch it about ten more times in a fairly short period of time before I had enough.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BAYRezJeZp0
 
  • #64


Borek said:
Westworld.

It's funny how you can see a lot of the inspiration for Terminator in Westworld.My top sci-fi movies, in no particular order, are...

20,000 Leagues Under the Sea (what inspired me to get into the submarine field)
The Abyss
Forbidden Planet
Close Encounters of the Third Kind
Logans Run
Stargate
The Time Machine (H.G. Wells original)
Tron
War of the Worlds (Wells original)
Aliens (2)
Predator
 
  • #65


The doors open. A teacher and some children exit. The guy falls in love. That's priceless. It's interesting how silent movies progress the plot, and the Flash Gordon type music is awesome. I have the movie on my netflix queue and will watch it this weekend if it arrives in time. The version they are distributing mentions it has been restored to include the 1927 orchestral score, but I don't think it's Moroder's version. I'm downloading that right now, just to make a comparison.

Hmm, just found out that Freddy Mercury sings the first song on the Moroder version soundtrack 'Love Kills'. He also composed all the music for Flash Gordon. I guess that's why I make the connection. Other artists on the soundtrack are Pat Benetar and Bonnie Tyler.

This is going to be good!
 
  • #66


Huckleberry said:
Here's one Danger might like, 'Cherry 2000'. A guys robotic girlfriend (Pamela Gidley) breaks down in an unfortunate lovemaking accident involving a dishwasher. The part necessary to repair her is no longer in production so he heads to the uncivilized wastes and hires Melanie Griffith to help him track down spare parts.

I've been trying to find that damned movie for years, because I really want to see it. Good call. I never watched 'Dune'. Three times I tried to read the book and quit within 20 pages because it disgusted me to an unprecedented degree. Something about opening the book describing an obese predatory gay pedophile with a boy and a globe in his study put me off.
I must repeat myself here, from a previous thread, that 'Sci-Fi' is an horrendously insulting term to SF fans. It's like calling a man's wife a whore. Something like 'The Core' or 'Signs' or 'The Butterfly Effect' or 'Godzilla vs. the Smog Monster' are Sci-Fi. Things like 'Star Wars' or 'The Last Starfighter' are science-oriented fantasy. (I love both, bye the by.) Then you have science-oriented comedy such as 'Men In Black' or 'Galaxy Quest'.
True SF is creature-oriented (usually human, or an analogy thereof) with plausible scientific elements. 'Forbidden Planet', despite the robot, is a remake of 'The Tempest'. The 'Star Trek' episode 'Conscience of the King' is also rehashed Shakespeare.
As much as I hate cowboy ****, including westerns, I really enjoyed 'Firefly' and loved the 'Serenity' movie that came from it. Seeing cute little Summer Glau beat the living bejabers out of a barroom full of bad *** tough guys just made my day. (That's also why I love 'The Sarah Conner Chronicles'. :!))
I can barely remember THX1133, but I enjoyed it and the effects were remarkable for that era.
Still can't beat 'Flesh Gordon', though. I don't think that a single copy of the original hard-core version still exists, but the R-rated version is still way cool.
 
  • #67


Danger said:
I must repeat myself here, from a previous thread, that 'Sci-Fi' is an horrendously insulting term to SF fans. It's like calling a man's wife a whore.

Only to you as far as I know. :biggrin:
 
  • #68


Huckleberry said:
The doors open. A teacher and some children exit. The guy falls in love. That's priceless. It's interesting how silent movies progress the plot,

The story does tend to jump. Presumably some of that is the result of lost footage that was never recovered. It was also somewhat inherent in films from that time. But I tend to disagree wrt your particular example. Love at first sight... Surely you aren't so old that you've forgotten what it's like? :biggrin:
 
  • #69


Ivan Seeking said:
The story does tend to jump. Presumably some of that is the result of lost footage that was never recovered. It was also somewhat inherent in films from that time. But I tend to disagree wrt your particular example. Love at first sight... Surely you aren't so old that you've forgotten what it's like? :biggrin:

I can be a bit hard to read sometimes, but I do find the introduction endearing. Love at first sight isn't anything I remember personally, but I'm glad it's out there somewhere. It is priceless, and I get a little kick of humor out of it as well.

For future reference, in case you're wondering, a good indicator of whether I'm being serious or cynical is the nature of the material I'm commenting on. If I'm cynical about love I must be really low.

EDIT - Ivan, were you aware that at least some of that footage has been found?
http://www.reuters.com/article/ente...80703?feedType=RSS&feedName=entertainmentNews


Danger said:
I must repeat myself here, from a previous thread, that 'Sci-Fi' is an horrendously insulting term to SF fans. It's like calling a man's wife a whore.
Another man's wife or his own? I can think of a few times that might be a good thing. Probably not at Thanksgiving dinner though.

You can download Cherry2000 for free with bittorrent. You can also order it from Amazon.com for $10US new and about $6US used + shipping and handling. If you call up your local video store and request it they might be able to accommodate you in some way.

Summer Glau is a crazy, little sweetheart. Unfortunately, I think Sarah Connor Chronicles has seen its last season.:frown:
 
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  • #70


Huckleberry said:
EDIT - Ivan, were you aware that at least some of that footage has been found?
http://www.reuters.com/article/ente...80703?feedType=RSS&feedName=entertainmentNews

Wow! That is fantastic. Also, an interesting excerpt from your link:

..."Metropolis," which depicts a tumultuous class struggle in a vast, urban society, was the first film to be entered into UNESCO's Memory of the World Register -- which aims to preserve cultural achievements of outstanding significance.

Released in 1927, set a century later, the silent film was not a commercial success and nearly ruined the studio behind it. According to some estimates, it still ranks as one of the most expensive movies ever made once inflation is factored in...
 
  • #71


Ivan Seeking said:
Only to you as far as I know. :biggrin:

No, it's pretty standard among SF fans. It's really quite insulting, equivalent to using the 'N' word for African North Americans or the 'S' word for those of Latin background. It very seriously offends us, when applied to real SF. The aforementioned crap movies deserve the moniker; true SF does not.
 
  • #72


Does SF mean science oriented fantasy? I guess I've always realized there is a difference between movies like 'Killer Clowns from Outer Space' and 'Aliens', but I never thought to separate them into individual genres. I've always thought of fantasy movies to be something like 'Krull' or 'Conan the Barbarian'.

So let's see if I got the classifications right.
Sci-fi = 'Toxic Avengers', 'Monster A-Go-Go' or 'The Blob'
SF = 'Back to the Future', 'Donnie Darko' or 'The Lathe of Heaven'
Science comedy = 'Mars Attacks', 'Coneheads' or 'Idiocracy'

Is there a horror genre? Can one movie fit into more than one genre? This could be a fun game all by itself; guessing which genre a movie fits into.
 
  • #73


Huckleberry said:
Does SF mean science oriented fantasy? I guess I've always realized there is a difference between movies like 'Killer Clowns from Outer Space' and 'Aliens', but I never thought to separate them into individual genres. I've always thought of fantasy movies to be something like 'Krull' or 'Conan the Barbarian'.

So let's see if I got the classifications right.
Sci-fi = 'Toxic Avengers', 'Monster A-Go-Go' or 'The Blob'
SF = 'Back to the Future', 'Donnie Darko' or 'The Lathe of Heaven'
Science comedy = 'Mars Attacks', 'Coneheads' or 'Idiocracy'

Is there a horror genre? Can one movie fit into more than one genre? This could be a fun game all by itself; guessing which genre a movie fits into.

One of the things that draws me to you as a friend, Huck, is that you challenge me on an intellectual level that few others can achieve.
You have the categories a bit off. 'Back to the Future' is in the same classification as MIB; science-oriented comedy. I have the book 'Lathe of Heaven', but haven't read it in over 25 years, so I can't comment upon it. Never saw the movie, or even knew that one was made. Straight SF are things like 2001, Charly, the book version of 'Altered States' by Paddy Cheyevsky (sp?) who had his name removed from the film version. Most of Star Trek was true SF, given that they had to make most species humanoid in order for human actors to portray them. (I always found it amazing that the universal translator not only changed alien speech to English, but also holographically altered the speaker's lip movements so that deaf people could understand them. :biggrin:) As much as I detest Greenpeace, ST IV—The Voyage Home was my favourite Trek movie. I'm not sure if that's because of Scottie talking into the computer mouse or because of Catherine Hicks in a wet shirt. (Oh, who am I trying to kid...)
Horror/terror/psycho are a bit different, in that they are meant to scare the audience. In that regard, Alien qualifies as both horror and SF (the science was fairly accurate). There's a lot of overlap.
The main point is that true SF deals primarily with the human (or alien) condition in a setting that is scientifically plausible but beyond current technology. That's one of the coolest things about 'Charly'. It was total fiction when it was written ('Flowers for Algernon' by Daniel Keyes) and when it was filmed. The core technology that made it SF now exists.
Another thing that just fries my 'nads is the turn-around on movie rights. Phillip K. Dick wrote a pretty cool story called 'We Can Remember It For You Wholesale'. 30 or 40 years later, they decided to make it into a movie called 'Total Recall'. Once the movie hit it big, they novelized the screenplay into a book called 'Total Recall'. Same damned thing with 'Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep', which was filmed as 'Bladerunner', and then novelized as 'Bladerunner'.
I actually have more to say about the subject, but I'm staying over at W's place tonight. She's downstairs wearing not very much, and I'm up here conversing with you. My body took a vote, and the gonads won over the cerebral cortex by a significant majority.
I'll get back to you tomorrow.
 
  • #74


Haha! I should have read the end of your post first. What are you wasting your time with me for? Yup, that's me; always frustrating my friends on any level I can. Glad to be of service.:biggrin:

'Lathe of Heaven' is about George Orr (a Portlander) who is just an average guy who's only notable quality is his lack of personality. He discovers that his dreams change reality and this frightens him, so he decides not to sleep. He goes to see a psychiatrist who starts manipulating his dreams to his own advantage. I haven't seen the movie myself.

I also haven't seen 'Charly'. Looks like I'll have to add that to my list so I know what you're talking about.

Ok, I can already see I'm going to have a bit of a problem with the classifications. With advanced enough technology I might consider anything plausible. Something like time travel or faster than light velocity I would consider plausible with some hokey exposition. Something like 'A Boy and His Dog' with psychic dogs, or 'Lathe of Heaven' with reality changing dreams I didn't even stop to consider the plausibility even though there is no technology involved. I only consider the plausability within needs of the story itself. So... I'm guessing both of those movies would go into the sci-fi category because they aren't plausible outside the story, but just about anything with technology would go into the SF category.

And then again with the second part of the qualification, I see issues of the human condition in everything. Meaning can be applied to any event or sequence of events in layers upon layers. Characters exist in in settings, and the whole thing spins together on every axis in a plot that is unpredictable enough to provide an epiphany to the viewer, but not so unpredictable that the pattern becomes unfathomable in retrospect. All that is required for me to see an issue of the human condition in a story is that it provides that epiphany of meaning. Like that scene from 'American Beauty' where that videophile kid films a plastic bag floating on the breeze like a weird, purple jellyfish. Depending on the observer it could evoke a response of loneliness, or freedom, or purposelessness, or adventure or just about anything.

Now that I think about it, a plastic bag floating around says more to me about the human condition than say, 'Transformers 2'. So while that movie has robots and technology it doesn't appeal to the human condition and could safely be placed in the sci-fi category? What about something like 'Iron Giant' made into a live action film, or if Godzilla were a giant robot gone haywire?

Eh, I think I get the point I guess, though it's still a bit rough around the edges. There always seems to be something that defies being readily categorized. I don't like categorizing things specifically. It feels cumbersome. I can only imagine the arguments that shelf stockers at Blockbusters must suffer through.

Nobody has mentioned 'Contact' yet. That was a brilliant movie.
 
  • #75


Huckleberry said:
...or if Godzilla were a giant robot gone haywire?

Done!
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/c/cc/Mechagodzilla.jpg

;-)
 
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  • #76


Oh cool! I've never seen this guy. Not a fan of the movies so I probably still won't see him, but it will be at the top of my list of movies I would watch but never intend to see.
 
  • #77


Mechagodzilla if memory serves me well.
 
  • #78


Borek said:
Mechagodzilla if memory serves me well.

Yup lol Was a pretty good one
 
  • #79


Danger, please contact me privately - I can't reach you through the PM and your forum mailbox is full.
 
  • #80


Short Circuit was popular and pretty good but not sci-fi.
I really enjoyed Explorers and Enemy Mine.
Gattaca was more serious science fiction.
 
  • #81


Speaking of Godzilla...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OPoxF4gJPyY
 
  • #82


Ivan Seeking said:
THX 1138: I saw it when it first came out but that was in 1971. I just watched it again and amazingly it is still quite futuristic. Great movie! It stars Robert Duvall; directed by George Lucas and produced in part by Francis Ford Coppola.

Interesting world, but I wasn't convinced by the plot. About 6 out of 10 :wink:
 
  • #83


Borek said:
Interesting world, but I wasn't convinced by the plot. About 6 out of 10 :wink:

I'm sorry, but you can't link to Godzilla and be a sci-fi critic on the same day. :biggrin:
 
  • #84


Ivan Seeking said:
I'm sorry, but you can't link to Godzilla and be a sci-fi critic on the same day. :biggrin:

In my time zone I wasn't :-p
 
  • #85


Has anyone mentioned Outland?
 
  • #86


Borek said:
Danger, please contact me privately - I can't reach you through the PM and your forum mailbox is full.

I'm still trying to save my old PM's to HD, and having difficulty with it. Unfortunately, I can't send a PM while the box is full. I can't delete any, for the same reason that I never throw out a birthday card; they all are of significance to me. I'll try harder to get them stashed away, but I'm scared of losing some. For some reason, the 'save as txt' function isn't working properly for me.
 
  • #87


Try borek at chembuddy dot com.
 
  • #88


I did try that, Borek, and was totally lost. I can't read Polish. The 'kontakt' button seemed obvious, but didn't do anything as far as I could tell. :frown:
 
  • #89


I just watched A Boy and His Dog and Six String Samurai last night. I enjoyed both of them. Six String Samurai is definitely very cheesy though. Oh, and that band I mentioned was on the soundtrack is actually in the movie too.
 
  • #90


TheStatutoryApe said:
I just watched A Boy and His Dog and Six String Samurai last night. I enjoyed both of them. Six String Samurai is definitely very cheesy though. Oh, and that band I mentioned was on the soundtrack is actually in the movie too.

Are they the band playing at the first community Buddy comes to after rescuing the boy? I seem to remember a band playing there.

I like the music in your link, but the video is terrible. There is film footage in it, but I don't remember anything like that video in the movie.

Glad you liked the movies. I thought you would.

Over the weekend I saw both versions of Metropolis. It was refreshing to watch just for its differences from modern movies. The original remastered version had more subtitles and made a clearer story, but the Moroder version soundtrack was a great addition to the movie too. My favorite song was "Here She Comes" by Bonnie Tyler, followed by "Destruction" by Loverboy. Overall I think I prefer the remastered version for its effectiveness in telling the story, but watching both of them added to the enjoyment. It's the kind of movie I would watch several times and take a little something different away each time. Some may not be comfortable with the religious references and attitudes, but the main theme of the movie is a humanist message. Great movie!
 

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