Multi-Choice Question: Differentiable function

Click For Summary

Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around a differentiable function defined on the interval [0,1] with specified endpoint values f(0)=0 and f(1)=1. Participants are tasked with identifying which of three statements about the function is correct, focusing on properties such as monotonicity, the existence of a derivative equal to 1, and the presence of local maxima.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the application of the Mean Value Theorem and Darboux's theorem in relation to the statements. There are attempts to draw graphs to visualize the function's behavior and to identify counter-examples to the statements presented.

Discussion Status

There is an ongoing exploration of the statements, with some participants questioning the validity of certain assumptions and interpretations. Guidance has been offered regarding the Mean Value Theorem, and there is a recognition of the need for clearer problem statements. Multiple interpretations of the problem are being considered.

Contextual Notes

Some participants express difficulty with the phrasing of the problem and the implications of the statements, indicating potential language barriers. There are also mentions of typos and the need for clarification on specific points related to the function's derivative.

sergey_le
Messages
77
Reaction score
15
Member warned that some effort must be shown
Homework Statement
Let function ƒ be differentiable on interval [0, 1] and ƒ(0) = 0, ƒ(1) = 1.
Which of the following is true?
(Edited)
be f Differentiable function In section [0,1] and f(0)=0, f(1)=1. so:
a. f A monotonous function arises in section [0,1].
b. There is a point c∈[0,1] so that f'(c)=1.
c. There is a point c∈(0,1) where f has Local max.
I have to choose one correct answer.
 
Physics news on Phys.org
I don't see what you have done up until now in attempting to find the answer. A good start is to draw such a function, then think about things such as the mean value theorem and similar theorems. Then please post what you have and where you get stuck so that one may go on from there.
 
63946.jpg

such 1 Explains why a is wrong
such 2 Explains why b is wrong
I can't see why b is wrong, so I guess b is the correct answer.
But I can't prove it.
I tried with the Mean value theorem, and it didn't work.
I tried with Darboux's theorem but it didn't work either
 
I think you have a typo: you probably mean that your diagram (2) is a counter-example to (c).

Try looking at your two graphs; suppose someone tried to use one of them as a "counter-example" to b. Your drawn functions are continuously differentiable in that interval. I'll do (2); for (1), it's similar. At the minimum at x= m, you have f'(m)=0; you also have f'(1)>1. Since the function g(x)=f'(x) is continuous, there must be a k, m<k<1, so that g(k)= f'(k) = 1. So, that counter-example to (b) wouldn't work. I am not saying that this is a proof that (b) is correct, but the counter-counter proof might set you thinking.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: sergey_le
sergey_le said:
View attachment 254872
such 1 Explains why a is wrong
such 2 Explains why b is wrong
I can't see why b is wrong, so I guess b is the correct answer.
But I can't prove it.
I tried with the Mean value theorem, and it didn't work.
I tried with Darboux's theorem but it didn't work either
Why didn't the mean value theorem work?
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: nomadreid
sergey_le said:
Homework Statement:: Differentiable function
Homework Equations:: Differentiable function

be f Differentiable function In section [0,1] and f(0)=0, f(1)=1. so:
a. f A monotonous function arises in section [0,1].
b. There is a point c∈[0,1] so that f'(c)=1.
c. There is a point c∈(0,1) where f has Local max.
I have to choose one correct answer.

I had difficulty with the statement of your problem.

It looks like it should be stated somewhat like the following:

Let function ƒ be differentiable on interval [0, 1] and ƒ(0) = 0, ƒ(1) = 1.​
Which of the following is true?​
a.​
b.​
c.​

Is this a correct statement of the problem?
 
SammyS said:
I had difficulty with the statement of your problem.

It looks like it should be stated somewhat like the following:

Let function ƒ be differentiable on interval [0, 1] and ƒ(0) = 0, ƒ(1) = 1.​
Which of the following is true?​
a.​
b.​
c.​

Is this a correct statement of the problem?
Yes.
My English is not good.
I try to translate my questions into English.
I'm sorry
 
nomadreid said:
I think you have a typo: you probably mean that your diagram (2) is a counter-example to (c).

Try looking at your two graphs; suppose someone tried to use one of them as a "counter-example" to b. Your drawn functions are continuously differentiable in that interval. I'll do (2); for (1), it's similar. At the minimum at x= m, you have f'(m)=0; you also have f'(1)>1. Since the function g(x)=f'(x) is continuous, there must be a k, m<k<1, so that g(k)= f'(k) = 1. So, that counter-example to (b) wouldn't work. I am not saying that this is a proof that (b) is correct, but the counter-counter proof might set you thinking.
First off I have a typo. Thanks for noticing. English is not good.
I didn't understand how you know that f'(1)>1 ?
Could you please explain to me?
 
sergey_le said:
First off I have a typo. Thanks for noticing. English is not good.
I didn't understand how you know that f'(1)>1 ?
Could you please explain to me?
I think you should look at the Mean Value Theorem.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: nomadreid and sergey_le
  • #10
PeroK said:
I think you should look at the Mean Value Theorem.
thank you friend . I'm just trying to figure out how to do it
 
  • #11
sergey_le said:
thank you friend . I'm just trying to figure out how to do it
What does the MVT (Mean Value Theorem) say?
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: sergey_le
  • #12
sergey_le said:
I didn't understand how you know that f'(1)>1 ?
Could you please explain to me?
Note that the slope of the line between your endpoints is 1, and then look at the first diagram to the right in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mean_value_theorem, and then read the caption.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: sergey_le
  • #13
Thanks so much everyone.
I understand
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: nomadreid

Similar threads

Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
2K
  • · Replies 14 ·
Replies
14
Views
3K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
1K
Replies
1
Views
2K
Replies
15
Views
2K
Replies
9
Views
1K
  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
2K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
2K