Multiplicative Identity under Matrix Multiplication

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the properties of singular matrices and their potential to form groups under matrix multiplication. Participants explore the concept of multiplicative identities in this context, questioning whether singular matrices can possess inverses and how they relate to group theory in linear algebra.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Exploratory
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses confusion about identifying a group of singular matrices, noting that singular matrices are non-invertible, which complicates the existence of a group.
  • Another participant suggests that a multiplicative identity can be any matrix that satisfies the condition AI=IA=A, not just the identity matrix, and provides an example of a singular matrix.
  • A classmate's claim that a specific matrix can serve as the multiplicative inverse of the singular matrix is questioned, leading to further exploration of the properties of these matrices.
  • Some participants propose examples of groups of matrices, including those with specific non-zero entries, and discuss how changing the basis can yield different representations of these groups.
  • Conjectures are made regarding the existence of stable subspaces under group actions and the implications for invertibility of transformations on those subspaces.
  • Participants discuss the injectivity of homomorphisms from groups of matrices to general linear groups, with some expressing uncertainty about the conditions under which this holds.
  • Concerns are raised about the uniqueness of stable subspaces and the implications for the characterization of groups of matrices acting on vector spaces.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the existence of groups of singular matrices or the nature of their multiplicative identities. Multiple competing views are presented regarding the properties and definitions involved.

Contextual Notes

There are unresolved assumptions regarding the definitions of singular matrices, the nature of multiplicative identities, and the conditions under which groups can be formed. The discussion includes various mathematical conjectures and claims that have not been definitively proven or agreed upon.

rachbomb
Messages
4
Reaction score
0
I've been asked by my professor to identify a group of singular matrices. At first, I did not think this was possible, since a singular matrix is non-invertible by definition, yet to prove a groups existence, every such singular matrix must have an inverse.

It has been brought to my attention, however, that a multiplicative identity need not be the typical diagonal "identity matrix" but can instead be any matrix for which AI=IA=A.
For example, take the matrix
[3 3]
[0 0].
Since the determinant for this matrix is 0, it satisfies the singular aspect. However, my classmate is claiming that the multiplicative inverse for this matrix is
[1/3 1/3]
[0 0], which would indeed satisfy the above requirement of AI=IA=A.

Is this possible? Please help, I'm so confused!
 
Physics news on Phys.org
A very simple example of a group of matrices under matrix multiplication is the set of all nxn matrices whose entries are all zero except for the upper-left entry, which is nonzero.
 
I need to find an example of a group of singular, non-diagonal matrices under matrix multiplication. Does such a thing exist?
 
Why is the multiplicative inverse allegedly acting like the multiplicative identity?

I think I see the group that your classmate was pointing towards. Multiplying your matrices
3 3
0 0

and

1/3 1/3
0 0

together we get a matrix

1 1
0 0

These matrices have something in common. Their bottom row is zero.
 
You can get your friends and Hurkyl's examples to match by changing the basis.
eg
P = \begin{pmatrix}1&1\\0&-1\end{pmatrix}
A = \begin{pmatrix}a&0\\0&0\end{pmatrix}
P^{-1} A P = \begin{pmatrix}a&a\\0&0\end{pmatrix}

I guess that nearly all examples you find will reduce like this.
Basically almost every group can be represented by invertible matrices.
The representation we have above is essentially the direct sum of an invertible rep and the group of one element
0 = id
 
take any group of n-1 x n-1 matrices then extend them to dimension n by multiplying the last basis vector by zero.
 
Conjecture: Given a group G of matrices acting on a vector space V, there is a subspace U of V that is stable under G (i.e. g(U) is contained in U for each g in G), and restricting the elements of G to U gives an injective homomorphism from G to GL(U).
 
I don't know about the injective part but the invertible part is easy

Let U be the smallest vector subspace which is stable under action by G... this exists and is unique since if W,T are stable under G, G takes W\cap T to both W and to T so it takes W\cap T to W\cap T. Then if the matrices are invertible on a stable subspace they must also be invertible on the restriction to this subspace so it suffices to only look at the smallest stable subspace. We will call this U

Claim: the identity element of G, call it I, acts as the identity on U. If we prove this, then we have proven that all the other elements of G are invertible when restricted to U. Suppose not. We know that I2=I so I is a projection onto a subspace of U, call it W. Claim: all elements A of G have A(U) is a subset of W (which means that U was not the smallest stable subspace since W is stable in particular). We know that IA=A and Au=IAu=Iv for some v in U. Iv is in fact in W so Au is in W.

Hence I acts as the identity on U and the group is in fact invertible linear transformations on U.Now let U be the largest subspace such that G is invertible linear transformations. If T and W are subspaces in which G acts invertibly (is that the right word?) on them, then G acts invertibly on T+W. Again we only need to confirm that the identity acts as the identity on T+W, but I(+w)=It+Iw=t+w. So U exists and is unique.

If the matrices all act differently, it will be on this subspace but I don't have a proof or counterexample to this
 
My point about the injective homomorphism was that G could be regarded as a subgroup of GL(U); the goal was to characterize all groups of matrices on V.

If you chose U to be the smallest stable subspace, then U would clearly be 0, which is totally uninteresting. (In that case, the homomorphism G -> GL(U) would be trivial, since GL(U) is.)
 
  • #10
adriank said:
My point about the injective homomorphism was that G could be regarded as a subgroup of GL(U); the goal was to characterize all groups of matrices on V.

If you chose U to be the smallest stable subspace, then U would clearly be 0, which is totally uninteresting. (In that case, the homomorphism G -> GL(U) would be trivial, since GL(U) is.)

Right. That just shortens the proof a little bit. The idea is that you only pick U small to show that there exists a subspace in which every matrix acts invertibly on; then you switch gears and look at the largest such subspace. That most likely won't be 0. You can't say look at the largest such subspace without proving that subspaces on which G acts invertibly on exist though. I was just typing on the fly so it was a pretty ugly way to describe things

To shorten things up considerably:

Let U=I(V). Since I2=I, I truly acts as the identity on U, which means that every element A of G when restricted to U acts as an invertible transformation (with inverse being A-1 in G restricted to U). Then what we need to do is show that if A and B are in G and A,B act identically on U, they act identically off of U as well.
 
  • #11
I have a proof. Let e be the identity of G, and let U = e(V) be the image of e.

U is stable under G, since for g in G and u in U, we have g(u) = e(g(u)) is in U. And in fact, e acts as the identity on U, since for u in U, we have u = e(v) for some v in V, and e(u) = e(e(v)) = e(v) = u.

Now for g in G, let ρ(g) = g|U denote the restriction of g to U; since U is stable under g, we regard ρ(g) as a linear map from U to U. It's clear that for g and g' in G, we have ρ(gg') = ρ(g)ρ(g'). The claim is that ρ(g) is in GL(V). Indeed, if g-1 denotes the inverse of g in G, then ρ(g)ρ(g-1) = ρ(gg-1) = ρ(e) is the identity of GL(U), and likewise for ρ(g-1)ρ(g). Thus ρ is a group homomorphism from G to GL(U).

Finally, we must show that ρ is injective. So if g is in ker(ρ), then ρ(g) = ρ(e) so g acts as the identity on U. But then clearly g = e, since G is a group.

edit: Ahhh, you just posted before I did. But I showed ρ is injective.[/size]

The conclusion: If G is a group of operators acting on a space V, then G is isomorphic to a subgroup of GL(U) for some subspace U of V.
 
  • #12
g acts as the identity on U, but g could do something outside of U that's different than e. I don't think it can in finite dimensional cases from trying to construct an example but maybe some weird infinite dimensional situation can screw you up
 
  • #13
But you see: g = ge = e. If v is in V, then e(v) is in U, so g(e(v)) = e(v).
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
3K
  • · Replies 17 ·
Replies
17
Views
7K
  • · Replies 26 ·
Replies
26
Views
1K
  • · Replies 25 ·
Replies
25
Views
3K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
3K
Replies
13
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
3K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
3K
  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
3K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
3K