Musing on which element discussed most in physics class

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around which elements are most frequently discussed in physics classes, with participants sharing their rankings and perspectives on the importance of various elements in different contexts. The scope includes theoretical considerations, educational contexts, and the relevance of elements in various scientific disciplines.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Exploratory

Main Points Raised

  • One participant ranks the top three elements discussed in physics classes as Hydrogen (Z=1), Helium (Z=2), and Uranium (Z=92).
  • Another participant argues that Carbon is more important than Helium or Uranium, suggesting that the top four elements should include Carbon, Hydrogen, Oxygen, and Nitrogen (CHON).
  • A participant emphasizes that the discussion should focus on which elements are talked about in physics classes rather than their importance in general.
  • One participant notes that the relevance of elements varies depending on the subject matter, mentioning that Hydrogen and Helium are often discussed in astronomy, while Uranium may come up in nuclear discussions.
  • Another participant provides a detailed analysis of elements discussed in various contexts, such as electromagnetic theory, quantum mechanics, and geology, highlighting the importance of elements like Silicon, Aluminum, and Calcium in different scientific discussions.
  • A participant references a textbook index to provide a quantitative perspective on how often certain elements are mentioned, listing Hydrogen, Helium, Carbon, and others with their respective reference counts.
  • There is a light-hearted comment about the "element of surprise" in relation to test questions, indicating a playful tone in the discussion.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on which elements are most discussed, with no consensus reached. Some emphasize the importance of context in determining which elements are relevant in physics classes, while others focus on specific rankings.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight that the discussion of elements can depend heavily on the specific topics being covered in physics, such as mechanics, astronomy, or nuclear science, and that different educational contexts may lead to varying emphases on certain elements.

CPW
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My child is learning the periodic table for science class, memorizing elements 1 - 20. Middle school.
While I assisted, I mused on the elements and on which are discussed most in physics classes.
Here is my ranking of the top three:
1. Z=1
2. Z=2
3. Z=92

Do you agree?
 
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Somehow I think carbon is much more important than helium or uranium. The top four are probably CHON - the stuff of life.
 
The question isn't which are important, it's which get talked about in physics classes.
 
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CPW said:
Here is my ranking of the top three:
1. Z=1
2. Z=2
3. Z=92

Do you agree?
You missed Si.
 
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I don't recall any elements getting discussed in a mechanics class. Hydrogen and helium is more an astronomy thing. I suppose uranium might come up if the atomic bomb were discussed.
 
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CPW said:
My child is learning the periodic table for science class, memorizing elements 1 - 20. Middle school.
While I assisted, I mused on the elements and on which are discussed most in physics classes.
Here is my ranking of the top three:
1. Z=1
2. Z=2
3. Z=92

Do you agree?
The element discussed depends on the subject at hand. Hydrogen (proton) is perhaps discussed in terms of it's simplicity. In EM/QM/Astronomy, one is likely to discuss Lyman, Balmer and Paschen spectral lines. He would be next. If one discusses stars, then H/D and He would be discussed, and C, N, O. Digging deeper, one might get into Li, Be, B as well as C, N, O. Life science related topics would certainly involve H, C, N, O.

If one discusses planets or geological topics, then certainly Al, Si, O, and probably Na, Mg, P, S, Cl as well. If one discusses minerals, crystals, X-ray diffraction, then one might add additional common light elements.

Nuclear science topics, e.g., natural decays series would certainly involve U, but perhaps all elements (and their isotopes from Bi/Pb on up). http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/Nuclear/radser.html

I would recommend printing a copy of the periodic table and posting it in the child's room.
https://www.nist.gov/system/files/documents/2019/12/10/nist_periodictable_july2019.pdf

I have it saved on my computer desktops for quick reference. Note the rows and columns.

Transition elements begin with Scandium (Sc), a rather rare and expensive element, but it is an important alloying element with Al. Note the elements, Ti and V, which are important light elements used in structural alloys. Cr, Mn, Fe, Co, Ni are used in a variety of structural alloys, e.g., steels, stainless steels (predominantly Fe), Ni-based superalloys, Co-based superalloys, . . . Cu is an important conductor, Si and Ge are important for semiconductors, and in fact, SiC is an important structural ceramic and semiconductor.

Edit/update: One could also consider Ca a structural element, a principal component of animal skeletons (bones) and exoskeletons, and limestone CaCO3.

Calcium is the most abundant metal and the fifth-most abundant element in the human body.[5] As electrolytes, calcium ions (Ca2+) play a vital role in the physiological and biochemical processes of organisms and cells: in signal transduction pathways where they act as a second messenger; in neurotransmitter release from neurons; in contraction of all muscle cell types; as cofactors in many enzymes; and in fertilization.[5] Calcium ions outside cells are important for maintaining the potential difference across excitable cell membranes, protein synthesis, and bone formation.
Ref: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Calcium
 
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Hornbein said:
Hydrogen and helium is more an astronomy thing.
How can we forget QM?
 
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I just looked at Halliday, Resnick and Walker, 9th edition. From the index, including applications:

  • Hydrogen: 47 references.(excluding references to protons)
  • Helium: 11 (including alpha particles)
  • Carbon: 17 (includes allotropic forms)
  • Oxygen: 15 (includes oxides, excludes water)
  • Neon: 4
  • Sodium: 8
  • Aluminum: 2
  • Silicon: 4
  • Iron: 14 (includes steel)
  • Copper: 36
  • Gold: 3
  • Mercury: 4
  • Lead: 7
  • Radon: 2
  • Uranium: 42
 
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Vanadium 50 said:
Sodium: 8
Is chlorine (Cl) mentioned in conjunction with Na, as in NaCl?

I looked for an index for Halliday, Resnick and Walker, 9th edition on line, but I could not find one, just TOC.
 
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How about the "element of surprise" ??

As in my favorite question: "is that going to be on the test"?

/
 
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  • #11
Astronuc said:
The element discussed depends on the subject at hand ...
That is a CliffsNotes summary.:smile:

Although,
Astronuc said:
He/She/They would be next.
is more acceptable in some classrooms
 

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