Orthonormal Vectors: Solve Your Homework

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around understanding the properties of orthonormal vectors, specifically focusing on the notation and implications of the dot product of these vectors. Participants are trying to clarify the meaning of the term "vi" and the equation vi * vi = 4.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants are attempting to understand the definition of "vi" and how it relates to the base vectors provided. There are questions about the meaning of the dot product in this context and whether the equation vi * vi = 4 applies to all base vectors.

Discussion Status

Some participants have provided clarifications regarding the notation and the nature of the dot product, while others are still seeking to understand the implications of the statements made in the textbook. There is an ongoing exploration of the assumptions behind the mathematical expressions used.

Contextual Notes

There is a noted lack of clarity in the textbook regarding the value of "i" and how it applies to the vectors in question. Participants express confusion over the absence of explicit definitions or statements that would typically accompany such mathematical expressions.

g.lemaitre
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Homework Statement



Screenshot2012-07-24at33839AM.png


Homework Equations


The Attempt at a Solution



I don't understand how they get vi * vi = 4
What is vi?
I can't do any work on the problem because I can't even figure out step 1.
 
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See example 1 in your book. The base vectors v1, v2, v3, v4 are given there.

According to the further text, they should be v1=(1,1,1,1), v2=(-1,-1,1,1,), v3=(-1,1,-1,1), v4=(-1,1,1,-1).

ehild
 
I'm guess that vi = v1 + v2 + v3 + v4 because that = 2 and 2*2 = 4

Is that correct?
 
vi means the i-th base vector. vi˙vi is the dot product of vector vi by itself.


ehild
 
I don't know what the i-th base vector is
 
g.lemaitre said:
I don't know what the i-th base vector is
For example, if a basis consists of the vectors ##u_1,u_2,u_3,u_4##, and i=2, then the ith basis vector is ##u_2##. Similarly, ##v_i## denotes one of the vectors ##v_1,v_2,v_3,v_4##. The value of i determines which one.
 
Last edited:
Fredrik said:
For example, if a basis consists of the vectors ##u_1,u_2,u_3,u_4##, and i=2, then the ith basis vector is ##u_2##. Similarly, ##v_i## denotes one of the vectors ##v_1,v_2,v_3,v_4##. The value of i determines which one.
the book never tells me what the value of i is.

I looked at example 1 and there is no help there.

Screenshot2012-07-24at65509AM.png
 
vi is any of the vectors v1,v2,v3,v4.

ehild
 
well if you take the dot product of v1 and v2 you get 0 not 4
 
  • #10
g.lemaitre said:
well if you take the dot product of v1 and v2 you get 0 not 4

Who said that v1˙v2 should be 4?

ehild
 
Last edited:
  • #11
It says vi * vi = 4

So if vi is any of the vectors 1 through 4, then you should be able to choose any two vectors, take the dot product and it should = 4.

In short, I want to know why vi * vi = 4
 
  • #12
g.lemaitre said:
It says vi * vi = 4

So if vi is any of the vectors 1 through 4, then you should be able to choose any two vectors, take the dot product and it should = 4.

In short, I want to know why vi * vi = 4
NOT 'any two vectors'.The two 'i's are the same. vi*vi is the dot product of any one vector with itself. If they had meant the dot product of any two vectors they would have written vi*vj.
 
  • #13
thanks, i got it now.
 
  • #14
g.lemaitre said:
the book never tells me what the value of i is.
This author has chosen not to write out any "for all" statements. This is strictly speaking an abuse of mathematical language, but it's very common, so you will have to get used to it.

You need to be aware that in mathematical proofs, every variable that isn't assigned a specific value must be part of a "for all" or "there exists" statement. For example, these statements are all OK:

1. Since x=2, we have x2=4.
2. There exists a real number x such that x2=2.
3. For all real numbers x, we have x2≥0.

But this one isn't (strictly speaking):

x2≥0.

So when you see a statement like ##v_i\cdot v_i=4##, you have to figure out if the value of i has been specified elsewhere, or if the statement is part of a "there exists" or "for all" statement. This is always easy, because an assignment of a value to a variable is never left out deliberately, and the phrase "there exists" is also never left out deliberately. So unless there's a typo, there's a "for all" missing. (That's why it can be left out without confusing people with more mathematical maturity)

In this case, it's clear that the author meant that "For all i in the set {1,2,3,4}, we have ##v_i\cdot v_i=4##". And this obviously means that

##v_1\cdot v_1=4##
##v_2\cdot v_2=4##
##v_3\cdot v_3=4##
##v_4\cdot v_4=4##
 

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