Partial differential equations: general solution

Click For Summary

Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around a second-order homogeneous partial differential equation (PDE) involving mixed partial derivatives. The original poster seeks to transform the equation into a simpler form with new variables, indicating a need for a change of variables to eliminate complexity in the algebraic expressions.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Assumption checking, Problem interpretation

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants suggest various methods for transforming the PDE, including changing variables and rotating axes. The original poster expresses difficulty in simplifying the resulting expressions. Some participants propose specific transformations and the use of the chain rule for partial derivatives.

Discussion Status

There is an ongoing exploration of different transformation techniques, with some participants providing guidance on how to proceed with the calculations. Multiple interpretations of the transformation process are being discussed, but no consensus has been reached on a single method.

Contextual Notes

The original poster mentions encountering messy algebraic expressions during their attempts, indicating potential constraints in their approach. The discussion includes references to specific forms of PDEs and the conditions under which certain coefficients should be set to zero.

sachi
Messages
63
Reaction score
1
I have a 2nd order homogenous P.D.E:

(d^2)V/((dx)^2) + (d^2)V/((dy)^2) + 6(d^2)V/(dx dy) = 0

where all derivatives are partial derivatives. I need to transform this to form

a*(d^2)f/(dX^2) + b*(d^2)f/(dY^2) = 0 where a, b are constants and the derivatives are again partial, and f(X,Y) = V(x,y)

I I need to make a change of variables e.g x=cX +dY etc. but I get very messy algebraic expressions which I can't simplify. Thanks very much.
 
Physics news on Phys.org
You have V = V(x,y).

Then make the change of variables,

X = X(x,y)
Y = Y(x,y)

where,

X = y - m1x
Y = y - m2x

(It doesn't need to be any more complicated)

Now use the chain rule for partial differentials involving change of variables.
 
Last edited:
You need to rotate axes to eliminate the mixed partial. This is normally done by defining a new function H(w,z) such that:

[tex]w=xCos(a)+ySin(a)\quad\text{and}\quad z=-xSin(a)+yCos(a)[/tex]

with a to be determined so that the coefficient of the mixed partial in the final results is zero.

So, start calculating all the partials and substitute them into your equation and end up with a PDE in H(w,z), then determine a so that the coefficient of the mixed partial is zero. Solve the PDE in H(w,z), then substitute back x and y:

[tex]V(x,y)=H(xCos(a)+ySin(a),-xSin(a)+yCos(a))[/tex]

I'll start off the partials:

[tex]\frac{\partial V}{\partial x}=\frac{\partial H}{\partial w}\frac{\partial w}{\partial x}+\frac{\partial H}{\partial z}\frac{\partial z}{\partial w}[/tex]

so then:

[tex]\frac{\partial^2 V}{\partial x^2}=\frac{\partial}{\partial x}\left(\frac{\partial H}{\partial w}\frac{\partial w}{\partial x}+\frac{\partial H}{\partial z}\frac{\partial z}{\partial w}\right)[/tex]

So do that one, the mixed one, and then for y and then substitute them back into your PDE. It goes fast once you get going. Then solve for a to make the mixed one go away.:smile:

Edit: Hum . . . well maybe that too Fermat.:smile:
 
Last edited:
saltydog said:
...
Edit: Hum . . . well maybe that too Fermat.:smile:

Yeah :smile: That's the method we were shown for solving 2nd order pde's.

If the pde was of the form,

[tex]A\cdot \frac{\partial ^2V}{\partial x^2} + B\cdot \frac{\partial ^2V}{\partial x \partial y} + C\cdot \frac{\partial ^2V}{\partial y^2} = 0[/tex]

we would transform it to,

[tex]P(m_1)\cdot \frac{\partial ^2V}{\partial X^2} + Q(m_1,m_2)\cdot \frac{\partial ^2V}{\partial X \partial Y} + P(m_2)\cdot \frac{\partial ^2V}{\partial Y^2} = 0[/tex]

[tex]\mbox{However, rather than making, } Q(m_1,m_2) = 0 \mbox{ we would make } P(m_1) = 0 \mbox{ and } P(m_2) = 0[/tex]

This would give,

[tex]\frac{\partial ^2V}{\partial X \partial Y} = 0[/tex]

which is then easily integrated to give,

V = f(X) + g(Y)
============

where you would substitute for,

X = y - m1x
Y = y - m2x

You would get m1 and m2 when setting P(m1) = 0 and P(m2) = 0.

So, you could use any functions f() and g() that you liked, as long as their arguments were y - m1x and y - m2x.
 
Last edited:
Fermat said:
Yeah :smile: That's the method we were shown for solving 2nd order pde's.
If the pde was of the form,
[tex]A\cdot \frac{\partial ^2V}{\partial x^2} + B\cdot \frac{\partial ^2V}{\partial x \partial y} + C\cdot \frac{\partial ^2V}{\partial y^2} = 0[/tex]
we would transform it to,
[tex]P(m_1)\cdot \frac{\partial ^2V}{\partial X^2} + Q(m_1,m_2)\cdot \frac{\partial ^2V}{\partial X \partial Y} + P(m_2)\cdot \frac{\partial ^2V}{\partial Y^2} = 0[/tex]
[tex]\mbox{However, rather than making, } Q(m_1,m_2) = 0 \mbox{ we would make } P(m_1) = 0 \mbox{ and } P(m_2) = 0[/tex]
This would give,
[tex]\frac{\partial ^2V}{\partial X \partial Y} = 0[/tex]
which is then easily integrated to give,
V = f(X) + g(Y)
============
where you would substitute for,
X = y - m1x
Y = y - m2x
You would get m1 and m2 when setting P(m1) = 0 and P(m2) = 0.
So, you could use any functions f() and g() that you liked, as long as their arguments were y - m1x and y - m2x.

Thanks for point that out Fermat. That's a much better approach considering, after I looked into it a bit, that an arbitrary solution of the wave equation:

[tex]\frac{\partial^2 u}{\partial t^2}=a^2\frac{\partial^2}{\partial x^2}[/tex]

can be written in the form:

[tex]u(x,t)=F(x+at)+G(x-at)[/tex]

and thus I would suspect your m's above are related to the final coefficient on the x-partial term above. I'll work with it a bit.:smile:
 

Similar threads

Replies
2
Views
1K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
2K
Replies
3
Views
2K
Replies
5
Views
2K
  • · Replies 12 ·
Replies
12
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
2K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K
  • · Replies 18 ·
Replies
18
Views
3K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
2K