Please help - An ideal gas problem involving work on a mass

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around an ideal gas problem involving heat transfer and work done on a mass. The scenario includes a gas in a cylinder that absorbs heat while lifting a mass, with the goal of determining the final temperature of the gas after the process.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Assumption checking, Problem interpretation

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants explore the relationship between heat absorbed, work done, and changes in temperature. Questions arise about how to properly account for work done in lifting the mass and how to integrate this into the energy equations. Some participants express confusion over the correct application of formulas and the assumptions needed for the problem.

Discussion Status

The discussion is ongoing, with participants providing insights into the work-energy relationship and questioning the assumptions made about the system. Some guidance has been offered regarding the calculation of work done and the need to consider potential energy changes, but no consensus has been reached on the correct approach or solution.

Contextual Notes

Participants note the lack of information regarding the cross-sectional area of the cylinder, which affects the calculation of work done. There is also mention of the assumption that the space above the piston is a vacuum, which influences the interpretation of the problem.

kivarocket
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Please help -- An ideal gas problem involving work on a mass

1. An ideal gas has a heat capacity of 20 J/(mol*K). One mole of the gas is in a cylinder and absorbs 1000 J of heat and lifts a 10 kg mass a vertical distance of 2 m while expanding. If the initial temperature of the gas is 300 K, what is the approximate final temperature of the gas?



2. Q = mcΔT, ΔE = Q-W



3. I thought this would be straightforward, but I'm not getting the correct answer of 340K. I thought that I could set Q=1000 J, plug in m and c, and solve for Tf. In this case, Tf = (Q/mc) + Ti. This gives me only about 305 K.
 
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In ΔE = Q-W, you aren't accounting for the work done by the system as it is lifting a 10 kg mass a distance of 2 m. How would you find the work done in moving a distance d by a force F?
 
Work = a change in energy. I'm not sure how to integrate that into the problem. I've gone over this problem for hours trying to figure out what I'm missing. I could use W = PV, but I don't have enough info. I was trying to use the delta E equation but I'm lost on the steps.
 
It should be ΔE=mcΔT, not Q=mcΔT. The latter is correct only if the volume is constant. You need to calculate the work that the gas does in lifting the weight, assuming that the weight is initially at equilibrium and that there is vacuum above the weight. The work the gas does is the change in potential energy of the weight. PΔV=mgΔh.

Chet
 
This must involve a substitution that I'm not catching. The knowns are: heat capacity (c), heat (Q), mass (m), distance (x), initial temp (Ti) and looking for Tf.
If I have PΔV = mgh, do I need to sub in mcΔT somehow to incorporate c, Q and ΔT? Would anyone be able to show me the work on how this could be written out? Thank you!
 
kivarocket said:
This must involve a substitution that I'm not catching. The knowns are: heat capacity (c), heat (Q), mass (m), distance (x), initial temp (Ti) and looking for Tf.
If I have PΔV = mgh, do I need to sub in mcΔT somehow to incorporate c, Q and ΔT? Would anyone be able to show me the work on how this could be written out? Thank you!

mcΔT=Q-W=Q-mgh
 
kivarocket said:
This must involve a substitution that I'm not catching. The knowns are: heat capacity (c), heat (Q), mass (m), distance (x), initial temp (Ti) and looking for Tf.
If I have PΔV = mgh, do I need to sub in mcΔT somehow to incorporate c, Q and ΔT? Would anyone be able to show me the work on how this could be written out? Thank you!
In order to do this problem correctly you have to be able to determine how much work is done. Since the problem does not give you the cross-sectional area of the cylinder, you have to assume that the space above the piston inside the cylinder is a vacuum. So the only work done is, as Chestermiller says, mgΔh (using W = PΔV, W = (mg/A)ΔV = mgΔh). [Otherwise P = (mg/A + Patm). So the work done would be PΔV = (mg/A + Patm)ΔV = mgΔh + PatmAΔh].

Since W = mgΔh and, as you have noted, W = Q-ΔU you should be able to determine ΔU. Then it is just a matter of determining ΔT from ΔU (or ΔE as you have it - the change in internal energy). How is ΔU related to n and ΔT?

AM
 

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