Population 3 star (Pop III) candidate LAP1

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around Population III stars, specifically a candidate named LAP1, and the implications of recent observations from the James Webb Space Telescope (JWST) regarding these ancient celestial objects. Participants explore the characteristics of Pop III stars, their formation timeline, and the observational limits of current technology in detecting such distant objects.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants describe Pop III stars as composed primarily of helium and hydrogen, with minimal lithium, formed approximately 200 million years after the Big Bang.
  • There is a claim that previous candidates for Pop III stars have been ruled out based on not meeting specific criteria regarding their formation and properties.
  • Some participants express fascination with the JWST's ability to observe distant objects, questioning whether LAP1 is the furthest object detected.
  • Concerns are raised about the limits of observation due to the speed of light, suggesting that some galaxies may be permanently out of reach if they are receding faster than light can travel.
  • Participants discuss the technological advancements of the JWST, including its capabilities in spectroscopy and its infrared wavelength focus, which may allow for better redshift measurements and dating of early galaxies.
  • There is mention of the potential for the JWST to focus on lensed objects, enhancing its observational power.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express a mix of fascination and uncertainty regarding the capabilities of the JWST and the nature of Pop III stars. There is no consensus on whether LAP1 is indeed the furthest object detected, and discussions about the limits of observation remain unresolved.

Contextual Notes

Participants note the limitations imposed by the speed of light and the technological constraints of current observational tools, which may affect the detection of very distant objects.

pinball1970
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TL;DR
"Nakajima et al. presented James Webb Space Telescope observations of the z = 6.6 Population III (Pop III) candidate LAP1-B, which is gravitationally lensed by galaxy cluster MACS J0416. We argue that this is the first object to agree with three key theoretical predictions for Pop III stars." From the paper abstract.
"Pop III stars are thought to be composed entirely of helium and hydrogen with trace amounts of lithium, the ingredients left over after the Big Bang. They formed early on, around 200 million years after the universe began. These stars are extremely rare because they died out long ago, although scientists have hoped that the faint light from these distant, ancient objects would be detectable.

Previous Population III candidates have been ruled out because they didn't meet the three main predictions about their formation and properties."

This paper is claiming the main criteria have been met.

Full paper https://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.3847/2041-8213/ae122f

Softer read here https://phys.org/news/2025-11-astronomers-stars-big.html
 
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sbrothy said:
I kinda keep coming back to this thread. I'm fascinated that Webb is seeing so far back in time, although for all I know this probably isn't the furthest?

EDIT: Not entirely on topic, I'm sorry, but it seems it really is close to the limit (then again I'm just a hack):

https://www.astronomy.com/science/a...-time-can-the-james-webb-space-telescope-see/
About 200 million years? After the BB?

One limit that cannot be beaten is the speed of light. If the light from a distant galaxy is moving away from us faster than that light can catch up, then that object will forever be out of reach.
Space can move faster than light.

They may be at the technology limit.

Webb can do better spectroscopy and to the pixel IIRC so that is useful for accurate redshift and dating objects.
The wavelength focus is IR which is possible because of the ingenious design and L2 placement.
Long wave length= very faraway=very old or formed only a few hundred million years after the BB. A few early galaxies already found and breaking records. MoM 14.4

It can also focus on lensed objects, a telescope times a telescope. Google Earendel.

https://science.nasa.gov/mission/webb/
 
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pinball1970 said:
About 200 million years? After the BB?

One limit that cannot be beaten is the speed of light. If the light from a distant galaxy is moving away from us faster than that light can catch up, then that object will forever be out of reach.
Space can move faster than light.

They may be at the technology limit.

I kind of expected as much. Also based on the short "article" I found there.


pinball1970 said:
Webb can do better spectroscopy and to the pixel IIRC so that is useful for accurate redshift and dating objects.
The wavelength focus is IR which is possible because of the ingenious design and L2 placement.
Long wave length= very faraway=very old or formed only a few hundred million years after the BB. A few early galaxies already found and breaking records. MoM 14.4

It can also focus on lensed objects, a telescope times a telescope. Google Earendel.

Wow!

pinball1970 said:
https://science.nasa.gov/mission/webb/
 

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