Relativistic Treatment of Core Electrons (DFT)

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the relativistic treatment of core electrons in density functional theory (DFT) calculations. Participants explore the reasons why core states are generally treated relativistically, focusing on the implications of relativistic effects on the behavior of electrons in heavy atoms.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants suggest that core electrons are treated relativistically due to their high speeds, which approach the speed of light, resulting from their proximity to the nucleus.
  • Others argue that the position-momentum uncertainty principle indicates that as electrons are localized near the nucleus, their momentum becomes more uncertain, leading to higher expectation values of speed.
  • A participant questions the relationship between momentum uncertainty and expectation values, suggesting that a large uncertainty in momentum could imply a smaller average momentum value.
  • Some participants discuss the virial theorem as a means to understand the relationship between kinetic energy and potential energy in a Coulombic potential, asserting that core electrons experience a largely unshielded nuclear potential.
  • There is mention of the analogy with planetary motion, where higher speeds are observed for planets closer to the sun, drawing parallels to the behavior of core electrons in atoms.
  • Participants express uncertainty about the fundamental reasons behind the relativistic treatment of core electrons, indicating a desire for deeper understanding.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree that relativistic effects are significant for core electrons due to their high speeds and the nature of their binding. However, there remains some disagreement and uncertainty regarding the underlying reasons and implications of these effects, particularly concerning the relationship between momentum uncertainty and average momentum values.

Contextual Notes

Some discussions involve complex relationships between kinetic and potential energy, as well as the implications of the uncertainty principle, which may not be fully resolved within the thread.

citw
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I realize this is something I should probably know intuitively, but why are core states (generally) treated relativistically in density functional calculations? What exactly makes these relativistic bound states rather than non-relativistic? I think this is some basic physics I'm forgetting.
 
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For example, the fact that mercury is liquid unlike most metals and that gold is not silver-colored are results of relativistic effects.

The closer the orbiting electron is to the nucleus, the higher the expectation value of its speed (result of position-momentum uncertainty principle), and relativistic effects are therefore more important in the case of core electrons.
 
hilbert2 said:
The closer the orbiting electron is to the nucleus, the higher the expectation value of its speed (result of position-momentum uncertainty principle), and relativistic effects are therefore more important in the case of core electrons.

Could you explain this consequence of the uncertainty principle?
 
When the electron is more localized near the nucleus (like in a core orbital), we know its position more precisely, and therefore its momentum is more uncertain according to the equation [itex]\Delta x \Delta p \geq \frac{\hbar}{2}[/itex] . When the momentum is more uncertain, the expectation value of speed (norm of velocity vector) must be higher. At high speeds, relativistic effects become important.
 
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hilbert2 said:
When the electron is more localized near the nucleus (like in a core orbital), we know its position more precisely, and therefore its momentum is more uncertain according to the equation [itex]\Delta x \Delta p \geq \frac{\hbar}{2}[/itex] . When the momentum is more uncertain, the expectation value of speed (norm of velocity vector) must be higher. At high speeds, relativistic effects become important.

Sorry, I thinking I'm missing something obvious. If

[tex]\Delta x\Delta p_x\geq \frac{\hbar}{2}[/tex]

and Δx is small near the nucleus, Δp is large, meaning

[tex]\Delta p_x=\sqrt{\big<p^2\big>-\big<p\big>^2}[/tex]

is large... the uncertainty in momentum should be large, but wouldn't this be more suggestive of a smaller momentum expectation value? E.g.,

[tex]\text{if }\sqrt{\big<p^2\big>-\big<p\big>^2}\text{ is large, } \big<p\big>^2\text{ could be small, or }\big<p^2\big>\text{ could be large.}[/tex]
 
citw said:
[tex]\text{if }\sqrt{\big<p^2\big>-\big<p\big>^2}\text{ is large, } \big<p\big>^2\text{ could be small, or }\big<p^2\big>\text{ could be large.}[/tex]

If the electron is in a bound state, [itex]\big<p\big>=0[/itex], because in the center-of-mass frame the electron is not moving to any specific direction on average. A higher uncertainty of momentum implies a higher expectation value for its absolute value.
 
The higher speed near the core is related to <KE> not dp, and can be understood via the virial theorem (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Virial_theorem), which applies to both QM and CM. Briefly, there is a definite mathematical relationship between <KE> and the mean potential for a Coulombic potential.

Note that in a closed shell atom, the potential at a distance R from the nucleus, V(R), depends mainly on the charge that is located in the region between 0 and R (from Gauss' Law). So, deep core electrons in heavy atoms experience a largely unshielded nuclear potential.

I believe that hilbert2 is essentially answering the question of how core electrons come about, which is more closely related to the uncertainty principle.
 
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^ Yes, we don't even need quantum mechanics to see that a particle orbiting in a [itex]1/r[/itex] potential has to have high orbital speed if [itex]r[/itex] is small. The centripetal acceleration of the particle in circular orbit is [itex]a = \frac{v^{2}}{r}[/itex], and as [itex]a\propto \frac{1}{r^{2}}[/itex] we get [itex]v \propto \sqrt{\frac{1}{r}}[/itex] .

In the solar system the planet Mercury, which is closest to the sun, has highest orbital speed and its orbital motion does not agree fully with Newtonian mechanics but can be explained with special relativity.
 
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citw said:
I realize this is something I should probably know intuitively, but why are core states (generally) treated relativistically in density functional calculations? What exactly makes these relativistic bound states rather than non-relativistic? I think this is some basic physics I'm forgetting.

Both their potential and kinetic energy are higher than that of the valence electrons. The high kinetic energy means that they have speeds near the speed of light so that relativistical corrections become important.
 
  • #10
DrDu said:
Both their potential and kinetic energy are higher than that of the valence electrons. The high kinetic energy means that they have speeds near the speed of light so that relativistical corrections become important.

What I've been trying to figure out (and what everyone is trying to explain to me) is why this is the case.
 
  • #11
gadong said:
The higher speed near the core is related to <KE> not dp, and can be understood via the virial theorem (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Virial_theorem), which applies to both QM and CM. Briefly, there is a definite mathematical relationship between <KE> and the mean potential for a Coulombic potential.

Note that in a closed shell atom, the potential at a distance R from the nucleus, V(R), depends mainly on the charge that is located in the region between 0 and R (from Gauss' Law). So, deep core electrons in heavy atoms experience a largely unshielded nuclear potential.

I believe that hilbert2 is essentially answering the question of how core electrons come about, which is more closely related to the uncertainty principle.

Ok, this is what I was thinking (stronger attraction near the nucleus), the the virial theorem is the perfect explanation. This is great, thanks.
 

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