# Riddle game - Something for you scientists

• Boxcutter
In summary, the conversation is about a riddle game that the participants are trying to solve. They are discussing clues they have found on different levels and sharing tips and advice on how to progress in the game. Some participants express frustration with their lack of knowledge in certain areas, but others offer help and encouragement. The participants also discuss the difficulty of the riddles and how some of them require knowledge of HTML or other technical skills.
Might be a coincidence but from the level name North and Bridge things are both indicate bridge the card game? I would of said the four face cards were players NSEW, with S as the other queen and dummy. but one card is the same ace wise? Maybe I'm just reading too much into the cards only the tens, aces and face cards score in bridge, the other cards are worth 0? Mmmm, will look again this evening after work.

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Yeah I tried the bridge connection as well, but couldn't make anything of it. I don't play bridge though, so tried to work out the scoring from wikipedia. By the way Boxcutter, this is by far the best quiz of this sort I have ever come across, absolutetly fantastic.

well...I seriously can't figure it out...I'll try again later

dduardo said:
Gokul43201, we are here:

Then Gale found this:

http://www.draculasriddle.co.uk/bodley/help.htm

Actually I discovered that about a page or two before Gale posted, since I havent' been that helpfull so far I'd hate to think my 1 small moment in the sun went unheeded, actually what am I on about it obviously did

I know that's terribly imodest but it's been eating me up all day, wha! but I said that

Putting the me in team work

http://www.draculasriddle.co.uk/bodley/greatflame.htm

putting the url on this page, too lazy to keep clicking back

Seriously I played notpron I stopped playing at level 8 when I found I had to use some sort of insider geekoid knowledge about html, because of my lack of skill with html I had to use the spoilers to get passed some levels; for me a good riddle should be about thinking not computer experience and so far I've yet to see any sign of how riddles can't be completed unless you know such and such a language format or jargon. This is much better than not pron, and I think the fact that we are the first means we really are getting these off our own backs and not cheating from spoliers, that makes it more fun and more rewarding.

Good job Box cutter, word of advice though, number and letter solving riddles are fun but don't forget the obscure knowledge once in while, like you did with the Devil hallway, googling it is also fun(I had to do some research on the number of the beast myself quite recently so I particularly enjoyed that level, off the top of my head I'd say... ) I think gale prefers them as well

I tried using the first letters of the cards numbers minus the picture cards. I came up with a few anagrams that made vague sense but none of the worked. i.e A staff feast and one or two others, nothing helps? I can't see any relation to those numbers in the cards, are they even related?

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thank you schrodinger and kazza for your kind words. it is always nice to get positive feedback. if you have any ideas in how to improve passed riddles, please let me know.

Heh, thanks for the extra hint boxcutter, working on it now.

extra hint...?

<!-- Read it x wise until your goal is reached, then fall in the negative y. Each row is a unit. -->

anyone around and trying to get this? i think we did loads better when we were all solving things together. i keep trying the same things with this one, i need some fresh ideas...

i was using the numbers on the card with their respective opperation, but with the division i get decimals, which i think is no good. I'm thinking you'll get 5 numbers when you go across, and 3 more down, and I'm hoping its just assigning letters to the numbers after that. first we have to find the numbers though...

also, with the new hint, i wonder if he meant literally a "unit" or 1. and then perhaps the cards are all variables. I'm going to fuss with that probably.

and anyway, i got a little bored, and went through this whole thread for inspiration. boxcutter apparently didn't realize I'm a girl, cause he called me a guy earlier. just thought i'd clear that up. does gale seem like a masculine name? everyone always thinks I'm a guy...

but back to the riddle. i think I'm the only one up, so i'll just diddle around some.

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May I ask what you have tried so far Gale? I looked at it a little bit yesterday, but I am going to begin working on it now for a little while.

P.S. I didn't think you were a guy...

I'll try again in a few minutes

i know I'm talking to myself but still...

i've been googling trying to get some ideas, and i don't know if the author intended it or not, but they have a deck of "elite" playing cards... the riddle uses traditional cards so i doubt it was intended as a pun. which makes me wonder if perhaps the word 'elite' refers to something else... either way, a note to the author: i think one reason we've gotten stuck as a group is because we take a lot of the words used literally, and mistake wrong things as clues. so, hopefully you're picky with words choices..

Yeah I've been trying more or less the same things gale. Trying to assign points to the cards in such a way that I don't end up with decimals. Have tried dozens of different ways but I can't seem to get anything.

I'm not sure about the fire/water/air/earth, might be a red herring. In tarot that is what the cards represent but I can't find any relevance to this problem.

I've tried heaps of points systems (based on card games I've found) where A=5,K=4,Q=3,J=2,10=1, or 10=5,A=4,K=3... etc as well as just A=14, K=13, Q=12, J=11, 10=1 etc... But I can't seem to find a way to do it without resulting in decimals.

"it all starts with zero."

There are three strings of numbers on the page, and they all start with zero, so perhaps the answer does as well.

Just thinking out loud.

Kazza_765 said:
Yeah I've been trying more or less the same things gale. Trying to assign points to the cards in such a way that I don't end up with decimals. Have tried dozens of different ways but I can't seem to get anything.

I'm not sure about the fire/water/air/earth, might be a red herring. In tarot that is what the cards represent but I can't find any relevance to this problem.

I've tried heaps of points systems (based on card games I've found) where A=5,K=4,Q=3,J=2,10=1, or 10=5,A=4,K=3... etc as well as just A=14, K=13, Q=12, J=11, 10=1 etc... But I can't seem to find a way to do it without resulting in decimals.

Yeah, I can never get all the rows to work out as integers...but like Gale said, lately we have been taking the wrong things literally and other things not literally enough...

yay! i much prefer doing these puzzles together. i thought i was all alone. anyway yeah, mostly I've been adding and multiplying trying to get some numbers that make sense. then take the 5 numbers and assign letters... so on.

the other thought i had was that we go x-wise first because its easier to equate equations of 3 unknowns, and then use the values to solve in the y direction. so if he was literally about the units thing then each row equals one and then you can solve for all the variables that way. if he's not literal i was still messing around. the best place I've seen to work from seems to be the first and last rows since they're very similar. also there's a lot of 5's

there's also 10 different cards, he doesn't use 4, 9, or 10. significant or not? dunno.

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Gale said:
yay! i much prefer doing these puzzles together. i thought i was all alone. anyway yeah, mostly I've been adding and multiplying trying to get some numbers that make sense. then take the 5 numbers and assign letters... so on.

the other thought i had was that we go x-wise first because its easier to equate equations of 3 unknowns, and then use the values to solve in the y direction. so if he was literally about the units thing then each row equals one and then you can solve for all the variables that way. if he's not literal i was still messing around. the best place I've seen to work from seems to be the first and last rows since they're very similar. also there's a lot of 5's

One interesting thing is that no suit repeats itself x-wise...it probably is nothing but it would give the answer you get for each row a suit.

also something that bugs me, is the "each row is a unit" so i try to treat each row separately. but rows 2 and 4 start with mult and division. so i haven't known how to treat that. i tried carrying the numbers from the row before, and i tried starting with zero, and with 1/x all with not fantastic results.

Omega_6 said:
One interesting thing is that no suit repeats itself x-wise...it probably is nothing but it would give the answer you get for each row a suit.

i'm not sure what you mean. the first row has two hearts...?

I've been wondering about that too, I also tried starting each row with one of the numbers from the background, so start row 2 with 25, row 3 with 5, which works well until row 5 which ends up with a decimal

Gale said:
i'm not sure what you mean. the first row has two hearts...?

Yeah, I don't know what I mean either Just a quick glance and I missed that...

i think the cards must be somewhat straightforward or he wouldn't use cards. i don't think they're random variables, and i really want to make it so each one has the value written on it. the division at the beginning of those two rows makes me think I'm approaching it wrong.

The other problem I'm having with this is that there are so many possible ways to look at this, and each one comes up with different numbers, that I don't know if I would even recognise the solution if I saw it.

For all I know I've stumbled upon it already and just dismissed it as another bunch of random numbers.

yeah, the latter puzzles haven't been as straightforward. before you'd see an answer and know you were right, it was just a matter of finding the answer. well, maybe this will seem straightforward once we get it. that's my hope at least.

ok, so I'm going to try to start over with my thinking.

first look, we have some cards, what can cards be? numbers usually. 13 cards per suit, 13*2 is 26, so you could use them for letters. can use them to represent patterns. think of poker hands. other card games...

ok next i see the sequences of numbers, no quickly discernable patterns...

source code gives operators for each card suit, and an element. gives directions to approach the ordering of the cards.

it seems blatantly obvious that the cards represent numbers that we're supposed to add subt mult and divide. then we get a sequence of numbers which logically we transform to letters like before.

soo... I'm still stuck where i was before starting over.

oh, i forgot about the words at the bottom... yeah, those seem useless. the start with zero seems obvious anyway cause all the other sequences started with zero. and unless by elite he meant 1337 i doubt its significant.

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i must admit that this one and the previous may have too many elements of confusion. however when i see your reasoning (especially some of gale's reasoning), i can't help but think that there is still hope left for you on this one. hence i will not be giving any more clues for now.

i hope you won't find future riddles as confusing as these two.

Wish I was in the same neck of the woods as you guys, only one thought this morning and that is elites refers to aces not the picture cards.

gosh its morning there already?? aye.. i need to sleep normal hours again sometime...

so some of my logic is promising... its a shame i posted so much then. have to figure out what i said that was good. just keep trying i guess.

Hmm. Perhaps the numbers in the background are the values of the picture cards? That would explain "it all starts with zero. The rest are for the elite"

If no ones mentioned it your probably looking for the values of columns not rows, 3 sets of numbers 3 columns btw.

The hint in the source code says that each row is a unit. But it also says read it in the x direction first, and then in the negative y, which seems to suggest both rows and columns are important.

Oh yeah sorry I just read that. Might be worth a try solving vertically then reading off rows? Probably not though.

i dunno, I'm getting nowhere...

Unfortunately I can't really try anything as I'm at work I'll have to look at the numbers later when I'm free to go over them. I'd imagine the numbers of cards would follow the blackjack system if no other system works i.e. 1-10 with aces being 1 or 11, can't take that for granted though.

I have the feeling someone will get desperate soon and try working in base 14

EDIT: Had a thought that the suits could indicate the operators hearts being add or whatever, just a thought, again no real time to experiment with it.

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Yeah, the operators are given in the source code as well. Hearts is +, spades /, diamond -, clubs *.

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