Riemann Integral: Proving $\int_a^b f = \int_a^c f + \int_c^b f$

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around proving the equality of Riemann integrals, specifically the assertion that if a function \( f \) is integrable over the interval \([a,b]\), then it is also integrable over the subintervals \([a,c]\) and \([c,b]\) for some \( c \in (a,b) \), leading to the equation \( \int_a^b f = \int_a^c f + \int_c^b f \). The scope includes mathematical reasoning and proof techniques related to Riemann integration.

Discussion Character

  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants assert that \( f \) is integrable on \([a,b]\) if and only if it is integrable on \([a,c]\) and \([c,b]\).
  • There is a discussion about the construction of partitions \( P_1 \) and \( P_2 \) for the intervals \([a,c]\) and \([c,b]\), respectively, and how to incorporate the point \( c \) into the overall partition \( P \).
  • One participant questions the equality \( U(f,P_1) - L(f,P_1) = [U(f,P \cup \{c\}) - L(f,P \cup \{c\})] - U(f,P_2) - L(f,P_2) \) and proposes an alternative formulation.
  • Another participant emphasizes the need for \( c \) to be included in the partition and discusses the implications of refining the partition to include \( c \).
  • There is a mention of the relationship between upper and lower sums and how they relate to the integrability of \( f \) over the specified intervals.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the treatment of the point \( c \) in the partitions and the validity of certain equalities in the proof. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the specific formulation of the equality involving upper and lower sums.

Contextual Notes

Some participants highlight the need for clarity on whether \( c \) belongs to the partitions \( P_1 \) and \( P_2 \), indicating potential ambiguities in the proof structure. There are also references to the conditions under which the inequalities hold, which may depend on the specific properties of the function \( f \) and the chosen partitions.

evinda
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Hello again! (Blush)

Let $f:[a,b] \to \mathbb{R}$ bounded and $c \in (a,b)$.Then $f$ is integrable at $[a,b]$ iff $f$ is integrable at $[a,c]$ and $[c,b]$.In this case,we have $\int_a^b f = \int_a^c f + \int_c^b f$.
The proof for the direction $\Rightarrow$ is like that:
Suppose that $f$ is integral.Let $\epsilon>0$.As $f$ is integrable there is a partition $P=\{a=t_0<t_1<...<t_n=b\}$ of $[a,b]$ such that $U(f,P)-L(f,P)< \epsilon$.
The point $c$ is in an interval $[t_i,t_{i+1}]$.Let's suppose,without loss of generality,that $c$ is not a endpoint of $[t_i,t_{i+1}]$.
So,we have the partitions:
$P_{1}=\{a=t_{0}<...<t_i<c\}$ of $[a,c]$ and $P_2={c<t_{i+1}<...<t_{n}=b}$ of $[c,b]$.
Therefore,$U(f,P_1)-L(f,P_1)\overset{1}{=}$$[U(f,P \cup \{c\})-L(f,P \cup \{c\})]-U(f,P_2)-L(f,P_2)$$ \leq U(f,P \cup \{c\})-L(f,P \cup \{c\}) \leq U(f,P)-L(f,P) < \epsilon$

But..how do we get to $\overset{1}{=}..$?? Isn't it $P=P_1 \cup P_2 \cup \{c\}$ ?
 
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evinda said:
Hello again! (Blush)

Let $f:[a,b] \to \mathbb{R}$ bounded and $c \in (a,b)$.Then $f$ is integrable at $[a,b]$ iff $f$ is integrable at $[a,c]$ and $[c,b]$.In this case,we have $\int_a^b f = \int_a^c f + \int_c^b f$.
The proof for the direction $\Rightarrow$ is like that:
Suppose that $f$ is integral.Let $\epsilon>0$.As $f$ is integrable there is a partition $P=\{a=t_0<t_1<...<t_n=b\}$ of $[a,b]$ such that $U(f,P)-L(f,P)< \epsilon$.
The point $c$ is in an interval $[t_i,t_{i+1}]$.Let's suppose,without loss of generality,that $c$ is not a endpoint of $[t_i,t_{i+1}]$.
So,we have the partitions:
$P_{1}=\{a=t_{0}<...<t_i<c\}$ of $[a,c]$ and $P_2={c<t_{i+1}<...<t_{n}=b}$ of $[c,b]$.
Therefore,$U(f,P_1)-L(f,P_1)\overset{1}{=}$$[U(f,P \cup \{c\})-L(f,P \cup \{c\})]-U(f,P_2)-L(f,P_2)$$ \leq U(f,P \cup \{c\})-L(f,P \cup \{c\}) \leq U(f,P)-L(f,P) < \epsilon$

But..how do we get to $\overset{1}{=}..$?? Isn't it $P=P_1 \cup P_2 \cup \{c\}$ ?

You answer yourself
without loss of generality,that $c$ is not a endpoint of $[t_i,t_{i+1}]$.
since it is not an end point for an interval like that so it is not in the partition
it is like we have a partition
x0--x1--x2--x3 : P
add c somewhere
x0--x1--c--x2--x3 : P U C

$U(P_1) = (x_1-x_0)M_1 + (c-x_1)M_2 , L(P_1) = (x_1-x_0)m_1 + (c-x_1)m_2 $

$U(P_2) = (x_2-c)M_3 + (x_3-x_2)M_4 , L(P_2) = (x_2 -c)m_3 + (x_3-x_2)m_4 $

$U(P \cup C) =(x_1-x_0)M_1 + (c-x_1)M_2 + (x_2-c)M_3 + (x_3-x_2)M_4 $
But
$U(P) = (x_1-x_0)M_1 + (x_2-x_1)M_* + (x_3-x_2)M_4 $
so
$ U(P \cup C) \leq U(P) $
M stands for the maximum of f(x) at the interval and m for the minimum of f(x) at the interval
and
$L(P) \leq L(P \cup C) $
So
$ U(P \cup C) - L(P\cup C) \leq U(P) - L(P) $...(**)
But still I can't see why :
$U(f,P_1)-L(f,P_1)\overset{1}{=}$$[U(f,P \cup \{c\})-L(f,P \cup \{c\})]-U(f,P_2)-L(f,P_2)$
I think it should be
$ U(P_1 ) - L(P_1) = U(P\cup C) - U(P_2) - ( L(P\cup C) - L(P_2)) $

My proof
$ U(P\cup C) - L(P\cup C) = U(P_1 ) - L(P_1) + U(P_2) - L(P_2) > U(P_1) - L(P_1) $
with (**) we get what we want
 
I haven't understood it.Does $c$ belong in the partitions $P_1$ and $P_2$ ?? :confused:(Thinking)
 
evinda said:
I haven't understood it.Does $c$ belong in the partitions $P_1$ and $P_2$ ?? :confused:(Thinking)

Since $$f\in \mathcal{R}(E)$$, there exists a partition $$P_{E}=\{t_0, t_1, ..., t_n\}$$, ($$a=t_0$$, $$b=t_n$$), such that $$U(f,P_E)-L(f,P_E)<\epsilon$$. Clearly $$c$$ must be contained in some interval $$[t_i,t_{i+1}]$$ (for $$0\leq i \leq n-1$$). Then a refinement can be put into $$P^{*}_{E}=\{t_0, ..., t_i, c, t_{i+1}, ..., t_n\}$$. We have $$U(f,P^*_E)-L(f,P^*_E)<\epsilon$$. Take $$P_{[a,c]}=\{t_0, ..., t_i, c\}$$ and $$P_{[c,b]}=\{c, t_{i+1}, ..., t_n\}$$. Hence, $$U(f,P^*_E)-L(f,P^*_E)=(U(f,P_{[a,c]})-L(f,P_{[a,c]}))+(U(f,P_{[c,b]})-L(f,P_{[c,b]}))<\epsilon$$. Hence $$U(f,P_{[a,c]})-L(f,P_{[a,c]})<\epsilon$$ and $$(U(f,P_{[c,b]})-L(f,P_{[c,b]}))<\epsilon$$. Hence $$f\in \mathcal{R}([a,c])$$, $$f\in \mathcal{R}([c,b])$$ and $$\int_a^b f=\int_a^c f+\int_c^b f$$.

Conversely, ...
 

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