Should I Become a Mathematician?

[tgt]

we only stopped working so hard after we became too old to do so in my case.

So I guess your role and responsibilities (i.e number of publications) have decreased as you got older? But still keep the professor title? Is that kind of the university?

 

[dsbyt]

my elder son has a real job, but he is also expert in internet hardware and software. i recommend getting as much experience as possible in computers.

your pure math background gives you a big advantage at the reasoning and problem solving skill that helps you in this area and every area.

Did he have actual qualifications in internet hardware and software and what were they?

Before with the other people you talked about (one went into something with CAD) it sounded like they were making quite a bit with a math PhD and presumably some other qualification. Do you know what other qualifications they had which let them get those jobs?

 

[mathwonk]

my son was a math major, when he went to work at a computer oriented firm.
while there he observed what was going on and began to educate himself further by reading and experience.

He used to say what he learned there could not be learned in class, as it was so far advanced from what is learned in school.

so he knew something about computers, something about programming, and was smart and had a math major. i myself am too ignorant to assess well what he knew, but it seems he learned much of it on the job, and that his math training in logical problem solving was key.

 

[mathwonk]

a professor's role and responsibilities include three areas: research, teaching, and service. If the participation in one area diminishes, it is usual for it to increase in another. kindness is not a word that comes frequently to mind in a professional setting, but it would seem odd to me to remove the title of professor from someone who begins to work less than 30 hour days as he ages.

 

[uman]

Mathwonk,

My dream is to become a professor, but I don't know of what. Math interests me however I don't know if I want to be a professional mathematician. Specifically what you've said about math consuming your life and requiring insane amounts of work scares me. Do all professors work this hard, or only mathematicians?

 

[mathwonk]

it is not only mathematicians who work hard. Virtually everyone works very hard who becomes successful at what they do. I suppose you have heard of medical doctors working 100 hour weeks as medical students, and I can assure you this happens.

In fact medical doctors apparently work even harder than mathematicians.

people who open their own businesses, such as restaurants, work amazing hours. Just talk to any successful person in business about how much time it takes to succeed.

The secret is to find a job you enjoy working at.

 

[tgt]

Do you think it's better to work consitently everyday, all year round or work in extreme amounts then totally relax for a short period like a vacation. I prefer the former what do you think? People who choose the latter are more the people who don't really enjoy what they do and need to take big breaks like CEOs. The great mathematicians worked ocnsistently and constantly?

 

[tgt]

a professor's role and responsibilities include three areas: research, teaching, and service. If the participation in one area diminishes, it is usual for it to increase in another. kindness is not a word that comes frequently to mind in a professional setting, but it would seem odd to me to remove the title of professor from someone who begins to work less than 30 hour days as he ages.

When thing I realized is that when you're a professor at the top of a field in your university, not many people in your university are able to understand let alone access your work. So who is going to judge your performance for the year?

Maybe when you get older, you are more experienced and recquire less time to do the three areas so don't need to work as much as you use to? But still get similar results?

 

[mathwonk]

unfortunately, partly for the reasons you mention, some people at a US university tend to simplify the evaluation of your scientific work, and often reduce it simply to: "how much grant money did you bring in?", which should be almost irrelevant.

a number of years ago we had a famous mathematician interview with our administration, and he was asked if he had any current grants, since none were visible on his vita. He responded indignantly, "No self respecting mathematician would list his GRANT MONEY on his vita!"

I assure you those days are long gone.

 

[tgt]

unfortunately, partly for the reasons you mention, some people at a US university tend to simplify the evaluation of your scientific work, and often reduce it simply to: "how much grant money did you bring in?", which should be almost irrelevant.

a number of years ago we had a famous mathematician interview with our administration, and he was asked if he had any current grants, since none were visible on his vita. He responded indignantly, "No self respecting mathematician would list his GRANT MONEY on his vita!"

I assure you those days are long gone.

Quiet unfortunate but it's happening as you say. One thing I often ask myself is if you can't beat them, join them. In other words, why not use your brains to make the most amount of money possible like in financial services? Have you considered such an option? Having witnessed the current situation in academia, do you think it's a worthwhile pursuit for the younger generation? Or does academia still have a decent, uncorrupted, anti money grabbing future?

 

[mathwonk]

well money is very helpful, but not sufficient. there is a dilemma, as one cannot be happy without enough money to pay bills, have healthcare, etc,...

but one has to do what one enjoys, and what one feels good about doing. when i am discussing math, i am a happy man, at least temporarily.

so do what you love primarily, but save your money, or invest it wisely.

 

[mathwonk]

it is probably best to work consistently. i am trying now, even in the midst of my teaching, to set aside at least an hour a day for research thoughts. that's enough to seed them, and then my mind takes over and pursues the themes many more hours in the day and night.

 

[PhysicalAnomaly]

I was forced to take the maths unit that is below my level because it is a prerequisite for later classes even though I've already covered all the material because of a technicallity. I've gotten into the habit of getting my hands on final year maths assignments from my friends and doing them. I've been finding them quite easy so far (been helping my friends in fact) but am worried that by the time I do those units, I'll be caught in the same situation as I'm in now - with all the material covered years before. Should I desist? What will I do to keep me occupied when I reach the final year units?

 

[mathwonk]

i am puzzled that you find it difficult to be challenged by math when math is so hard. have you read my recommended books?

 

[Gib Z]

I was forced to take the maths unit that is below my level because it is a prerequisite for later classes even though I've already covered all the material because of a technicallity. I've gotten into the habit of getting my hands on final year maths assignments from my friends and doing them. I've been finding them quite easy so far (been helping my friends in fact) but am worried that by the time I do those units, I'll be caught in the same situation as I'm in now - with all the material covered years before. Should I desist? What will I do to keep me occupied when I reach the final year units?

Personally, and not trying to brag, I am quite a few years ahead of my class mates (who are reviewing the Sine rule at the moment) and yet, it has never bothered me once. It doesn't matter if you have covered that work before - continue ahead on your own, and only do the set homework from those classes for some good revision all year round to make sure you don't fail your test and don't forget your basics. Nothing wrong with already knowing the material, just go ahead.

PS. Sorry to hijack this a bit mathwonk :( Just a personal view

 

[mathwonk]

happy to have your input.

 

[bubbles]

My professor is teaching introduction to linear algebra by copying definitions from the book onto the board and does not explain them. I am trying to do independent study for that class since both the textbook and the professor are bad. The professor said to "unlearn" geometry since algebra is not about geometry and told us to think algebraically. He teaches linear algebra from a computational/applied perspective (since that is his specialty), but does nothing but copy proofs and definitions onto the board and told us to memorize them. Is that good? I have always seen math geometrically as well as algebraically when possible. I am having trouble with my linear algebra course right now. Can you give me some advice on how to really learn linear algebra?

Also, how strong of a background do I need in linear algebra to take more advanced math courses (Linear Algebra II, Abstract Algebra, ...etc.)? How should I prepare?

 

[PhysicalAnomaly]

First of all, I'd like to note that I'm not trying to brag or anything. I'm just quite desperate to not go over stuff that I've already learned a few times over. For example, my lecturer is teaching us the binomial distribution as if it were something new. I learned that 4 years ago and have learned it or used it every year since! I feel pretty guilty about not paying attention in the lectures but neither can I bring myself to listen...

I'm breezing through Spivak. A lot of the exercises are at the A levels further maths level. I am working on Munkres and that's fun to read. But I'm worried that if I finish that in my first semester of the first year and then tackle other books at that level like Rudin and Dummit, I'd be bored in my 3rd year classes. In australia, it all seems to be pretty laidback, unlike the uk system. If I'm able to do the 3rd year assignments now, how bored will I be in the 3rd year?

PS I've not been neglecting my unit's work or anything. Been doing all the exercises and assignments like a good boy...

PPS The cause of all this is probably switcing to the australian system after A levels further maths. Going from learning linear algebra and groups to stuff that was learned years ago isn't very enjoyable.

 

[Gib Z]

Did you just completely ignore my post? I do happen to be in a similar position to you.

You have two choices:

Don't go learn ahead. That way you won't go over things you've learned before, maybe pay a bit more attention in class. Not further yourself, not actually achieve anything. Just slow yourself down for a stupid reason.

Or, Learn ahead. That way, you DO go over things you've learned before, which is a GOOD thing. When you learn ahead by yourself, you don't always pick every skill up at that one time. Many teachers have their own unique skills that they pass onto students, and going over the work again you'll always learn something new, even if its something small.

More concisely: Either learn ahead, and actually do something worth while, or just stay with your class and be an average student.

And yes, I know the Australian System is a bit slow compared to the UK, but that's still no excuse.

 

[mathwonk]

i guess after you solve the riemann hypothesis and the ABC conjecture, youll really be bored.

If you will go back and read a few of the recommended books in this thread, you'll find enough to interest anyone for life.

and i question whether you are really breezing through spivak unless you are not doing the problems. please try all the problems and then see how breezy it is.

 

[Gib Z]

Why don't you accelerate if you feel that confident that your so good? I know that the university of Sydney has an accelerated program but that was just for students who was in one of the three science Olympiads (Physics, Biology and Chemistry). But i would imagine that if you feel confident then you can take some of the course tests (should be on the internet) and if you score quite well, i would suggest you see the dean or physics head or what ever.

I went for work experience at USYD's math department and specifically asked if they had an acceleration program and they told me no! :( Why would they offer such a program to those who are in a science Olympiad program?

 

[tgt]

Just wondering how you like to tell others (when asked what you do) that you are a maths professor. What are their reactions? I find that the general public are impressed enough by a maths student. I just like to know what the reaction is when they hear you are a maths professor. Do you find that you are very respected being a maths professor?

 

[mathwonk]

I don't have a huge social life, so do not often tell it.
oh yes, and because i try to minimize the shock, i usually tell people i am a "math teacher".
this does not impress too many of them, since i do not use the "professor" title, unless pressed.

in fact when i started posting here, i declined to say i was a math professor for a long time, until quizzed about it.
up until then lots of people argued with me over my statements about math, and it bugged me that afterwards my opinions on math received more weight than they had before.

i.e. i started out believing that anonymous correct answers to math questions would impress people just by being correct, but eventually found that more people think i must know something about math because i am a professor, than think i am a professor because i know something.

 

[tgt]

I don't have a huge social life, so do not often tell it.

oh yes, and because i try to minimize the shock, i usually tell people i am a "math teacher".

this does not impress too many of them, since i do not use the "professor" title, unless pressed.in fact when i started posting here, i declined to say i was a math professor for a long time, until quizzed about it.

up until then lots of people argued with me over my statements about math, and it bugged me that afterwards my opinions on math

received more weight than they had before.

i.e. i started out believing that anonymous correct answers to math questions would impress people just by being correct,

but eventually found that more people think i must know something about math because i am a professor,

than think i am a professor because i know something.

By stating that you are a maths teacher, it could mean a primary school maths teacher so that would lessen the effect drammatically. It's funny because the average Joe might think more highly of a uni maths student then you, a 'maths teacher'.

Do you get treated really well when they do finally find out that you are a maths professor?

But I tend to be like you and don't like to show off too much. Maybe all mathematicians are like that?

 

[mathwonk]

well i have become more modest as I got older. maybe i realize that i have good reason to be modest.

Physical anomaly, I apologize for teasing you. You are in a position of needing guidance. Your ability is a blessing. There are many good books you can enjoy and be challenged by.

best wishes.

 

[mathwonk]

yes math professors do enjoy a certain fear/respect from many strangers. it does not last much past getting to know you though. then you get the treatment your personality commands or fails to command. i.e. people assume you are smart until you open your mouth too often.

 

[RufusDawes]

Just curious if any of you are planning to become a high school mathematics teacher ?

 

[mathwonk]

i would like to become one after i retire from university teaching, but i don't know if i can get hired, and I may not have the stamina to deal with teenagers.

 

[eastside00_99]

Hey mathwonk, I need some advice about the qualifying exams. I am going to CUNY, and there are 6 areas (out of which one choose three) that offer qualifying exams. You have two years to complete the exams, they are given three times a year, and you can only fail one exam twice before having to pick a different area. Here are the six areas:

1) Real Analysis
2) Complex Analysis
3) Algebra
4) Differential Geometry
5) Topology (starting with general topology)
6) Logic

At my undergraduate school, I took the graduate qualifying sequences in Algebra, Algebraic Topology, and Real Analysis. I also took half the qualifying sequence in Differential Topology. I have not had ANY complex analysis or Logic. So, basically, the way I see it, I have three options:

1) Take the sequences that would most prepare me for specializing in Algebraic Geometry (which is quite a big subject I know). As I see it, if I follow this plan, this would mean take the following sequences: Algebra, Topology, Differential Geometry.

2) Take the sequences that I know the least about as I probably have enough (not sure how to qualify that word enough though) knowledge of the above three areas to specialize in Algebraic Geometry. This would mean take: Logic, Complex Analysis, and Differential Geometry.

3) Just take the exams that I know the most about without necessarily taking the corresponding classes. For instance, I could study all summer for real analysis and algebra, and before the semester starts, take the exams. I would be using one of my chances, but the good thing is that you are not kicked out for failing an exam twice--you just have to choose a different sequence.

I think I may attempt the real analysis exam at the end of the summer regardless of which plan I take. Also, I need to talk to a few people about this. I know a lot of students who find out what exams are the easiest and then take those. But, I don't want to do that. Of course, I would not punish myself by taking the hardest exam just because it is hard and no body passes. I am open to advice which ones would you recommend?

 

[asdfggfdsa]

Hi, mathwonk:

I've been thinking about becoming an algebraist (after completing a course in Galois theory) - are there any texts which you would consider classics in algebra?

asdfg