Solve Uncertainty of Pi: Volume of Cylinder

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    Pi Uncertainty
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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the uncertainty of the mathematical constant pi in the context of calculating the volume of a right circular cylinder, given specific measurements for height and radius with associated uncertainties.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants explore whether pi has any uncertainty and how that relates to the uncertainties in the measurements of height and radius. There are attempts to clarify the nature of pi as a numerical constant and its implications for calculations involving uncertainty.

Discussion Status

Several participants assert that pi does not have uncertainty, emphasizing that it is an exact number. There is an exploration of the distinction between the exactness of pi and its representation as a non-terminating decimal. The conversation includes a consideration of how to handle uncertainties in the context of the given measurements.

Contextual Notes

Participants are working within the constraints of a homework problem that involves calculating volume with given uncertainties in measurements. The discussion reflects a need to clarify the role of pi in this context without providing a direct solution to the problem.

rejz55
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[SOLVED] uncertainty of pi?

does pi have any uncertainty? I am trying to solve the volume of a right circular cylinder with h=2.3±0.1 and radius 0.12±0.05m..i cannot continue cause i do not know if pi has an uncertainty..thanks
 
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No, it does not.
 
rejz55 said:
does pi have any uncertainty? I am trying to solve the volume of a right circular cylinder with h=2.3±0.1 and radius 0.12±0.05m..i cannot continue cause i do not know if pi has an uncertainty..thanks

pi has no uncertainty, but it is an infinitely long decimal number, so your calculator doesn't store the actual exact value of pi. but your caculator's value of pi does have enough digits that the error in pi can be ignored.

I.e., just calculate the uncertainty from the uncertainty in 'h' and the uncertainty in 'r'.
 
Numerical constants never have uncertainty. Pi, e, 2, 2.75, sqrt(5), etc. are all exact numbers.
 
rejz55 said:
does pi have any uncertainty? I am trying to solve the volume of a right circular cylinder with h=2.3±0.1 and radius 0.12±0.05m..i cannot continue cause i do not know if pi has an uncertainty..thanks

nicksauce said:
Numerical constants never have uncertainty. Pi, e, 2, 2.75, sqrt(5), etc. are all exact numbers.

rejz55, if there is conflation of exactness or uncertainty of the value of \pi vs. its not being a rational number, it is true that there are no pair of exact integers, N and D so that

\pi = \frac{N}{D}

but whatever the tolerance of "error" you give me (we'll call this tolerance \epsilon), it is true that one can always find a pair of integers for N and D so that the above is true within that level of tolerance. for whatever \epsilon>0 that you (or the devil) tosses at us, we can always find a rational number (a ratio of integers, N/D) that is "within \epsilon of" \pi:

\left| \pi - \frac{N}{D} \right| < \epsilon

or

\frac{N}{D} - \epsilon < \pi < \frac{N}{D} + \epsilon

where

\epsilon > 0

no matter how tiny \epsilon gets (as long as it remains bigger than zero).
 
thanks guys!
 

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