Solving 2 Electron Spin 1/2 System: Need Help!

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the calculation of expectation values in a two-electron spin 1/2 system within a magnetic field. Participants explore the use of density matrices and tensor products to address the challenges of working with different matrix sizes in quantum mechanics.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses confusion about calculating expectation values using a 4x4 density matrix and 2x2 operators, questioning how to proceed with the calculations.
  • Another participant suggests using the tensor product of the spin operator and the identity matrix to form a compatible 4x4 matrix for calculations.
  • A similar suggestion is reiterated by multiple participants regarding the use of the tensor product to calculate expectation values for specific spins.
  • One participant inquires about the possibility of rewriting Pauli matrices as 4x4 matrices using a different basis instead of relying on tensor products.
  • A participant confirms the structure of the tensor product for the Sz operator and expresses reluctance to write out the full 4x4 matrix explicitly.
  • Another participant introduces the concept of using reduced density matrices through partial traces to simplify calculations for each spin.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the use of tensor products for calculations but explore different approaches, including the potential for reduced density matrices. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the best method to proceed and whether alternative representations of the matrices are feasible.

Contextual Notes

Participants have not reached a consensus on the most effective method for calculating expectation values, and there are varying opinions on the use of tensor products versus reduced density matrices.

Noora Alameri
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Hey,

I am studying Spin 1/2 system, the case of 2 electrons in a magnetic field, since we have 2 electrons, we expect that the matrix will be of the size 4x4, which is what I have got.

As I know that I could use the density matrix to calculate the expectation values of any physical quantity such us <Sz> , <Sx> and <Sy> by taking the trace of the product of the density matrix with the one we want to find out.

but the point that disappointed me is that Sz operator for example is 2x2 matrix , and the density matrix is 4x4 ! I can't take a product of two matrices !

What is the best way to proceed ?

I am really struggling with this, I hope someone would help ()

Thank you
 
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If you want to calculate the expectation value of e.g. ##\sigma_z## for e.g. the first spin, you have to form the tensor product ##\sigma_z \otimes \sigma_0##, where ##\sigma_0## is the 2x2 unit matrix and calculate the expectation value using the density matrix and this operator.
 
DrDu said:
If you want to calculate the expectation value of e.g. ##\sigma_z## for e.g. the first spin, you have to form the tensor product ##\sigma_z \otimes \sigma_0##, where ##\sigma_0## is the 2x2 unit matrix and calculate the expectation value using the density matrix and this operator.

Thank You Doctor.
Appreciate your helpful reply ()
 
DrDu said:
If you want to calculate the expectation value of e.g. ##\sigma_z## for e.g. the first spin, you have to form the tensor product ##\sigma_z \otimes \sigma_0##, where ##\sigma_0## is the 2x2 unit matrix and calculate the expectation value using the density matrix and this operator.

I am wondering if there is a way to re write puali matrices in 4x4 matrix size with choosing 4 basis instead of using product ?
 
Yes,
$$ \sigma_z \otimes \sigma_0=\begin{pmatrix} \sigma_z & 0 \\ 0 & \sigma_z\end{pmatrix}$$. I am too lazy to write this explicitly as a 4x4 matrix.
 
The general way to write a tensor product of ##d \times d## matrices as a ## d^2 \times d^2 ## matrix uses the Kronecker product.

But if you are only interested in the observables for each spin, it might be easier to just calculate the ##2 \times 2## reduced density matrices ## \rho_A = \text{Tr}_B ( \rho_{AB}) ## and ## \rho_B = \text{Tr}_A ( \rho_{AB}) ## where the trace is the partial trace.
 

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