Speed of a bead turned through X degrees

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Homework Help Overview

The problem involves a bead on a circular wire in a vertical plane, projected from the lowest point with a specific speed. The discussion centers on determining the speed of the bead at various angles of rotation, specifically questioning the calculation of potential energy based on height above a reference point.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants explore the relationship between potential energy and height, questioning why height is defined as the difference between the radius and the vertical component of the radius rather than simply the vertical component itself.

Discussion Status

Some participants have provided insights into the reference height for potential energy and clarified the vertical height of the bead. There is ongoing exploration of graphical representations and the logic behind height calculations as the bead moves along the wire.

Contextual Notes

Participants are considering the implications of the bead's height above the reference point and the assumptions regarding the motion of the wire loop. Specific numerical examples are used to illustrate the concepts being discussed.

moenste
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Homework Statement


A small bead is threaded on a smooth circular wire of radius r which is fixed in a vertical plane. The bead is projected from the lowest point of the wire with speed √6gr. FInd the speed of the bead when it has turned through: (a) 60°, (b) 90°, (c) 180°, (d) 300°.

Answers: (a) √5gr, (b) √4gr, (c) √2gr, (d) √5gr

2. The attempt at a solution
While this question is explained here, I do not understand one part. Why PE = m * g * h = m * g * (r - r * cos(θ)). Specifically h = r - r * cos(θ)? Why isn't it equal to just h = r cos 60°?

Taking this image (as I see the problem):
serie4-7v.png

We have φ = 60°. R is h and equals to r cos 60°, where r is the adjacent line to the angle. Why the correct height h is r - r cos 60° and not just r cos 60°?
 
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The potential energy is taken as zero when ##\phi=0## So you want h to be the height above the reference height zero. ##h - h_0 = ...##
 
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h is the vertical height of the bead above the bottom of the wire loop, as explained by BvU.
upload_2016-9-15_10-21-7.png

Your picture indicates that the loop is rotating about the vertical axis with angular velocity ##\Omega##. But, apparently the problem wants you to assume the loop is not rotating.
 
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TSny said:
h is the vertical height of the bead above the bottom of the wire loop, as explained by BvU. Your picture indicates that the loop is rotating about the vertical axis with angular velocity ##\Omega##. But, apparently the problem wants you to assume the loop is not rotating.
What would be the correct graphical representation of the problem? Could you please give an example?

And with your image I think I got it. If we take two positions h = 0 at α = 0 and r = 10 cm (for example). When the bead moves to α = 60° the height is not 0, since the bead is in the air (if we take h = 0 as the moment when the bead is on the ground). In order to find h we need to subtract 10 cos 60° from the original radius, which is equal to 10. So h = 10 - 10 cos 60 = 5 cm. Is this the right logic?
 
moenste said:
If we take two positions h = 0 at α = 0 and r = 10 cm (for example). When the bead moves to α = 60° the height is not 0, since the bead is in the air (if we take h = 0 as the moment when the bead is on the ground). In order to find h we need to subtract 10 cos 60° from the original radius, which is equal to 10. So h = 10 - 10 cos 60 = 5 cm. Is this the right logic?
Yes, that's right.
 
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