Sum series- convergence and divergence

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the convergence or divergence of the series $$\sum_{n=1}^{\infty} a_n$$ where the sequence is defined by $$a_1 = \frac{1}{3}$$ and $$a_{n+1} = \sqrt[n]{a_n}$$. Participants explore various methods and reasoning related to the behavior of the sequence and the series, including definitions involving logarithms and numerical experiments.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose defining $$\lambda_n = \ln a_n$$ to analyze the sequence, leading to the conclusion that $$\lim_{n \to \infty} a_n = 1$$.
  • Others express confusion about the use of logarithms and the concept of difference equations, indicating a lack of familiarity with the topic.
  • A participant suggests that a numerical experiment shows $$a_n \to 1$$, which implies divergence of the series since for convergence, $$a_n$$ must approach zero.
  • Another participant mentions an alternative solution involving the limit of $$a_n = \left(\frac{1}{3}\right)^{\frac{1}{n!}}$$, which leads to a different perspective on the behavior of the sequence.
  • One participant discusses the boundedness of the sequence and proposes an inductive argument to show that $$a_n$$ is increasing and bounded below by $$a_1$$.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express varying levels of understanding and agreement on the methods used to analyze the series. There is no consensus on the correct approach or conclusion regarding the convergence or divergence of the series, as multiple viewpoints and methods are presented.

Contextual Notes

Some participants indicate limitations in their understanding of difference equations, which may affect their ability to engage with the proposed solutions. The discussion includes various assumptions and definitions that are not universally accepted among participants.

Chipset3600
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converge or diverge?

$$\sum_{n=1}^{^{\infty }}a_{n} $$

$$a_{1}= \frac{1}{3}, a_{n+1}= \sqrt[n]{a_{n}}

$$
Im having problems to solve this exercise, i would like to see your solutions
 
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Chipset3600 said:
converge or diverge?

$$\sum_{n=1}^{^{\infty }}a_{n} $$

$$a_{1}= \frac{1}{3}, a_{n+1}= \sqrt[n]{a_{n}}

$$
Im having problems to solve this exercise, i would like to see your solutions

Defining $\displaystyle \lambda_{n} = \ln a_{n}$ the difference equation becomes...

$\displaystyle \lambda_{n+1} = \frac{\lambda_{n}}{n}\ (1)$

... and for any $\displaystyle a_{1} \ne 0$ is $\displaystyle \lim_{n \rightarrow \infty} \lambda_{n}=0$, so that $\displaystyle \lim_{n \rightarrow \infty} a_{n}=1$, so that...

Kind regards

$\chi$ $\sigma$
 
chisigma said:
Defining $\displaystyle \lambda_{n} = \ln a_{n}$ the difference equation becomes...

$\displaystyle \lambda_{n+1} = \frac{\lambda_{n}}{n}\ (1)$

... and for any $\displaystyle a_{1} \ne 0$ is $\displaystyle \lim_{n \rightarrow \infty} \lambda_{n}=0$, so that $\displaystyle \lim_{n \rightarrow \infty} a_{n}=1$, so that...

Kind regards

$\chi$ $\sigma$

I don't understood...
Why u said that : $$\lambda_{n} = \ln a_{n}$$ ?
 
Chipset3600 said:
I don't understood...
Why u said that : $$\lambda_{n} = \ln a_{n}$$ ?

It is the first step to demonstrate that $\lim_{n \rightarrow \infty} a_{n}=1$...

Kind regards

$\chi$ $\sigma$
 
chisigma said:
It is the first step to demonstrate that $\lim_{n \rightarrow \infty} a_{n}=1$...

Kind regards

$\chi$ $\sigma$

Still don't understanding, and i never study "difference equation".
 
Chipset3600 said:
Still don't understanding, and i never study "difference equation".

Yourself wrote...

$\displaystyle a_{1}= \frac{1}{3},\ a_{n+1} = \sqrt[n] {a_{n}}\ (1)$

That is a 'difference equation' the solution of which is $\displaystyle a_{n}$...

Kind regards

$\chi$ $\sigma$
 
chisigma said:
Yourself wrote...

$\displaystyle a_{1}= \frac{1}{3},\ a_{n+1} = \sqrt[n] {a_{n}}\ (1)$

That is a 'difference equation' the solution of which is $\displaystyle a_{n}$...

Kind regards

$\chi$ $\sigma$

Im really trying to understand, but sorry!
resolution is too advanced for me to realize
 
Chipset3600 said:
Im really trying to understand, but sorry!
resolution is too advanced for me to realize

If You intend to improve Your knowledge about difference equations, on MHB there is a tutorial thread...

http://mathhelpboards.com/discrete-mathematics-set-theory-logic-15/difference-equation-tutorial-draft-part-i-426.html

Kind regards

$\chi$ $\sigma$
 
chisigma's suggestion is to see what happens to the original equation $a_{n+1}= \sqrt[n]{a_{n}}$ when we make a definition $\lambda_n=\ln(a_n)$. Then \[\lambda_{n+1}\stackrel{\text{def}}{=} \ln(a_{n+1})= \ln((a_n)^{1/n}) =\ln(a_n)/n \stackrel{\text{def}}{=}\lambda_n/n\] Thus, $\lambda_n\to0$ as $n\to\infty$, and $a_n=e^{\lambda_n}\to e^0=1$ as $n\to\infty$.
 
  • #10
The definition used is that it was strange for me...
My teacher give me other solution.
Taking the limit it will be equal to 1.
$$a_{n} = (\frac{1}{3})^{\frac{1}{n!}}$$
 
  • #12
Chipset3600 said:
converge or diverge?

$$\sum_{n=1}^{^{\infty }}a_{n} $$

$$a_{1}= \frac{1}{3}, a_{n+1}= \sqrt[n]{a_{n}}

$$
Im having problems to solve this exercise, i would like to see your solutions

A quick numerical experiment shows that $$a_n \to 1$$ and if this is indeed the case the series $$\sum_{n=1}^{^{\infty }}a_{n} $$ diverges since to converge $$a_n$$ must go to zero.

The simplest method of proving that $$a_n \not\to 0$$ is to show that if $$0<a_1<a_k<1$$ then $$0<a_1<a_{k+1}<1$$ which will show that $$a_n$$ is bounded below by $$a_1$$.

The approach I would use is induction based on the observation that if $$0<a_k<1$$ and $$a_{k+1}=\sqrt[k]{a_{k}}$$ then:

$$a_{k+1} < 1$$

and

$$a_{k+1}^k=a_k$$

but for any $$\kappa>1$$ we now can conclude $$a_{k+1}^{\kappa}<a_{k+1}$$ and so:

$$a_k<a_{k+1}$$

Thus $$\{a_n\}$$ is an increasing sequence and so bounded below by its first term.

In addition any other method that shows that $$\{a_n\}$$ is an non-decreasing sequence would do (which includes at least one form of the ratio test).

.
 

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