Temporal Gradients at Event Horizons of Black Holes

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the effects of temporal gradients at the event horizons of black holes, particularly in relation to the experience of a hypothetical traveler falling into a black hole. Participants explore the implications of time dilation and the perception of time from different frames of reference, focusing on the distinction between infalling observers and stationary observers near the event horizon.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • One participant suggests that a traveler falling into a black hole would experience a "temporal fossilization" effect, where their feet would appear to age significantly faster than their head due to the temporal gradient at the event horizon.
  • Another participant counters that the infalling observer's head and feet are both on the same infalling trajectory, thus negating the proposed differential aging effect.
  • It is argued that the perception of clocks by an infalling observer differs from that of a stationary observer, with infalling observers seeing clocks above them running slow, rather than fast.
  • Clarifications are made regarding the effects of tidal gravity on the perception of time between two infalling observers, suggesting that they would not perceive significant differences in clock rates, except for minor effects due to their separation.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express disagreement regarding the effects of temporal gradients at the event horizon, with no consensus reached on the implications for a traveler's experience as they approach the black hole.

Contextual Notes

The discussion involves complex concepts of general relativity and time dilation, with participants relying on different interpretations of how time is perceived by observers in varying states of motion relative to a black hole.

Kostik
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TL;DR
Does the temporal gradient in the immediate (external) vicinity of an event horizon of a black hole result in "fossilization" of any object with non-zero size crossing the event horizon?
While there is much discussion about "spaghettification" when approaching a black hole (BH) singularity due to tidal forces, many discussions say, rather casually, that a hypothetical traveler would free-fall right through the event horizon (EH) of a large BH without noticing anything.

Doesn't this scenario ignore the temporal gradient at the EH? Specifically, to any observer outside the EH, a clock approaching the EH appears to slow down. And from the point of view of a traveler approaching the EH and looking backward (in the direction opposite to which he is moving), a clock located a fixed distance from the EH appears to speed up. Therefore, if a real traveler (say a six-foot human) approached the EH -- suppose oriented head-first along his trajectory -- wouldn't he see his feet age a million years in a split-second? In other words, a clock attacked to his feet would be running much faster than a clock attached to his neck. Won't this "temporal tide" essentially fossilize (i.e., infinitely age) anything larger than a point-particle as it approaches the EH? So it seems to me that the real unpleasantness of entering a black hole is not the physical spaghettification near the singularity, but the "temporal fossilization" near the EH.

Is this right?
 
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Kostik said:
Is this right?
It's not right. The infalling observer's head and feet are both on infalling trajectories.

You are trying to compare the infalling observer's feet, say, with a "stationary" observer, hovering at a certain radius outside the event horizon. Such an observer would be very different from the infalling observer's head.
 
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Kostik said:
Is this right?

No. See below.

Kostik said:
from the point of view of a traveler approaching the EH and looking backward (in the direction opposite to which he is moving), a clock located a fixed distance from the EH appears to speed up.

No.

To an observer hovering just above the hole's horizon, and not falling in, clocks that are hovering higher up appear to be running fast.

To an observer falling in to the hole, clocks that are hovering higher up appear to be running slow, not fast.

But to an observer falling into the hole, a clock a bit higher that is also falling in, does not appear to be running slow or fast, except to the (small) extent that the two clocks are moving apart because of tidal gravity--that makes each one see the other running a bit slow.
 
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Thank you both!
 

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