How Many Trips Will a Bird Make Between Two Trains Before They Crash?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Rainbow
  • Start date Start date
Click For Summary
SUMMARY

The discussion centers on a mathematical problem involving two trains approaching each other at speed v and a bird flying back and forth between them at speed w, where w > v. The conclusion is that while the bird makes an infinite number of trips before the trains collide, the total time taken for the collision is finite and can be calculated as L/(2v). This is a classic example of a converging series, illustrating that infinite processes can yield finite results. The anecdote about John von Neumann highlights the unexpected simplicity of the solution.

PREREQUISITES
  • Understanding of basic kinematics and relative motion
  • Familiarity with infinite series and convergence
  • Knowledge of mathematical modeling in physics
  • Ability to apply calculus to solve motion problems
NEXT STEPS
  • Study the concept of infinite series and their convergence in mathematics
  • Learn about relative velocity in physics and its applications
  • Explore mathematical modeling techniques in real-world scenarios
  • Investigate the implications of limits and continuity in calculus
USEFUL FOR

Students of physics, mathematicians, and anyone interested in the intersection of mathematics and real-world applications, particularly in motion and series convergence.

Rainbow
Messages
62
Reaction score
0
Here’s a question that I’m stuck with.
Two trains initially separated by distance L are heading towards each other on the same track each with speed v, and a bird flies from train A towards B with constant speed w>v reaches train B and immediately comes back to A with same speed and continues to do so till it sandwiches between the two. Find out the number of trips and time taken before it sandwiches.
I solved it mathematically and got the answer as infinity, which I find hard to accept. I think this is due to the wrong mathematical approach. I mean, at some point of time the velocities of both the trains and the bird change to zero. So, I think we would have to account for this sudden change of variables in our equations. But, the question is how.
 
Mathematics news on Phys.org
'The answer'? You were asked two questions. There certainly will be an infinite number of trips (this is a perfectly valid thing in a model like this that has nothing to do with reality). But the time taken certainly isn't infinite. Indeed, the time taken can be deduced without even thinking about the bird.
 
This goes to a series with an infinite number of terms, or trips, but finite value, or time taken.
 
This remembers me of an anecdote about the famous mathematician John von Neumann:


When this problem was posed to John von Neumann, he immediately replied,
"150 miles."

"It is very strange," said the poser, "but nearly everyone tries to sum the
infinite series."

"What do you mean, strange?" asked Von Neumann. "That's how I did it!"
 
How long does it take for the trains to touch each other?
 
daniel_i_l said:
How long does it take for the trains to touch each other?

As long as v is not equal to 0, wouldn't that actually be "...for the trains to crash into each other"? Poor bird.
 
Two trains initially separated by distance L are heading towards each other on the same track each with speed v
So they are closing on one another at speed 2v. It will take time L/2v (in whatever units are appropriate) for the two trains to "touch" (more correctly, crash). Since the bird flies at speed w, in that time it will have flown distance Lw/2v.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 14 ·
Replies
14
Views
2K
  • · Replies 20 ·
Replies
20
Views
3K
  • · Replies 26 ·
Replies
26
Views
3K
  • · Replies 31 ·
2
Replies
31
Views
5K
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
1K
Replies
8
Views
3K
  • · Replies 30 ·
2
Replies
30
Views
3K