The Calculated Value of the Fine Structure Constant From Gravitational Potential

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around a conjecture linking the gravitational potential to the Fine Structure Constant, exploring its implications and the credibility of the presented research. The scope includes theoretical considerations and the potential for experimental validation of the conjecture.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Meta-discussion

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants note that the Fine Structure Constant is a key constant in physics, yet its value lacks a theoretical explanation, with references to Feynman's sentiments on the subject.
  • One participant mentions a paper that calculates the Fine Structure Constant based on an integral of the gravitational potential over the universe's hypersphere, achieving a value within 1 part in 5000.
  • A temporal variation in the Fine Structure Constant is predicted, with measurements expected to be feasible in ongoing research.
  • Concerns are raised about the credibility of presenting at the APS meeting, emphasizing that being scheduled does not inherently validate the research unless it is an invited talk.
  • Some participants express skepticism about the reception of uninvited presentations at such meetings, highlighting the potential for harsh critique from attendees.
  • There is a discussion about the motivations for presenting work at conferences, with some participants suggesting that the aim should be to seek constructive feedback rather than validation.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the credibility of the paper based on its presentation status at the APS meeting, and there is no consensus on the validity of the conjecture itself or the appropriateness of the presentation context.

Contextual Notes

Participants acknowledge the potential for skepticism and critique at the APS meetings, particularly for unconventional work, which may affect how presentations are received.

Who May Find This Useful

Individuals interested in theoretical physics, the Fine Structure Constant, gravitational potential, and the dynamics of academic presentations may find this discussion relevant.

dtfroedge
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This paper conjectures a relation between the gravitational potential and the value of the Fine Structure Constant. Although a key constant in all electromagnetic quantum and quantum field theories, accept for some numerology manipulations, the value of the Fine Structure Constant is not explained by any theory of current physics. Feynman, who remained mystified by the constant is quoted as having said "all good theoretical physicists put this number up on their wall and worry about it.”. A list of many of the mathematical calculations that attempt to calculate the value can be found on the website of Ivan Gorelik, at: http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Nebula/3735/fine.html. None of the previously presented calculations however offer a physical basis for the calculated results. The presented paper offers a conjecture and calculates the value based on an integral of the gravitational potential over the universe hypersphere. Given an initial radius for the universe of 9 Planck radii, and other currently known physical constants, the value if alpha is calculated within 1 part in 5000. A temporal variation in Alpha is predicted, the measurement of which is within the capabilities of ongoing research, and will be determined within the next few years.(G. Gabrielse et al). At the April (2007) APS meeting in Jacksonville, Gabrielse predicted further improvements in the precision of the measurement, which will greatly reduce the detection time for a temporal variation.
One cannot consider this conjecture to be more than a speculation until such time as the calculations can be pushed to a higher accuracy or the predicted temporal variation detected. DTF
 

Attachments

Physics news on Phys.org
This paper is scheduled for presentation at the April meeting of the APS in St Louis 1:30 PM, Sunday, April 13, 2008
http://meetings.aps.org/Meeting/APR08/Event/83394.

The paper has undergone a few revisions the latest of which is located at:
http://www.arxdtf.org/css/alpha.pdf
 
Last edited by a moderator:
For reference to those who are not familiar with it, in the APS March and April meetings, anyone can register to attend and present a contributed talk. It literally is open to anyone. Thus, being scheduled to present at such a meeting alone doesn't add "credibility" to what is being presented, unless one received an invited talk.

Zz.
 
ZapperZ said:
Thus, being scheduled to present at such a meeting alone doesn't add "credibility" to what is being presented, unless one received an invited talk.

Zz.
Its being presented to provoke critique. Engendering "credibility" is for those who need their ego's stroked.
 
dtfroedge said:
Its being presented to provoke critique. Engendering "credibility" is for those who need their ego's stroked.

If that's the case, then why would you even mention it here? It is completely irrelevant to the evaluation of the validity of the content.

Zz.
 
ZapperZ said:
If that's the case, then why would you even mention it here? It is completely irrelevant to the evaluation of the validity of the content.

Zz.
It should strike your mind that someone reading the paper might be at the APS meeting and be interested enough to stop by, Physicists do attend the meeting.
 
dtfroedge said:
It should strike your mind that someone reading the paper might be at the APS meeting and be interested enough to stop by, Physicists do attend the meeting.

Good luck!

And for your information, *I* will be at this meeting as well.

Zz.
 
ZZ
I am looking forward to meeting you
DTF
 
dtfroedge said:
ZZ
I am looking forward to meeting you
DTF

Oh, I don't think our path will cross at all unless you suddenly become curious about particle accelerators.

Zz.
 
  • #10
Delivering an "invited" paper I presume.
 
  • #11
P.S.
dtfroedge said:
Delivering an "invited" paper I presume.

LOL!

Nice series of papers, I look forward to reading them more carefully.

I have found that the local APS meetings are more suitable than the big one. At the big meeting, they tend to put all the amateurs into the same room and ignore them.

As far as the question, "is it possible for an amateur to give an 'uninvited' presentation at an APS meeting and have any physicists pay attention to it?" I would like to point out that my presentation at the APS NW meeting a few years ago is referenced in the peer reviewed literature here:
http://www.worldscinet.com/cgi-bin/details.cgi?id=pii:S0217732307022621&type=html

Downloading the actual paper will require an expensive subscription (but will be available at any decent university). The formula for the lepton masses given in the abstract is my modification of Koide's formula. So it can be done, but in the above case, the actual reference is to a local conference, not the nationwide meeting.

But I really don't think it matters either way. If it turns out that your work is correct, you will eventually be given credit for it as your work is published in the APS literature. Between now and then, you will have that much more time to work on new stuff without competition. And if it's not correct, why worry about people ignoring it? Just enjoy each day.
 
  • #12
CarlB:
I have a number of friends that go to the April meeting, and I enjoy going whether of not I present anything, This years conference is particularly good, with some really interesting papers on gamma ray astronomy, and pulsar binaries.

Be warned, that if you’re not doing conventional physics, you have to expect a high degree of skepticism, and sometimes very harsh critique. The "drive by" generalists who know a little physics, and like to impress people with their sarcasm, are ever-present and are quick to yell “quack quack quack”. If your psychic needs adulation and recognition for work, this is the wrong arena, and you'll do a lot better at getting pictures of Paris Hilton. If your goal is to figure out something that nobody else has, your hearts in the right place.

Personally, I put things up, and present talks, to get a little input, and despite the downsides, on occasion there are some very useful response. Thanks DTF
 

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