The gravitational field at a mass point produced by an infinite plane

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the mathematical derivations related to the gravitational field produced by an infinite plane, as presented in Feynman's Lectures. Participants are exploring specific mathematical results and their derivations, focusing on calculus concepts and the relationships between variables in the context of gravitational fields.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Homework-related

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants question the validity of the expression for the area of a ring, ##2\pi\rho d\rho##, and seek clarification on why it holds true under the condition ##d\rho \ll \rho##.
  • There is a discussion about deriving the relationship ##\rho\,d\rho = r\,dr## from the equation ##r^2 = \rho^2 + a^2##, with participants attempting to differentiate both sides and expressing confusion over the process.
  • Participants express uncertainty regarding the derivation of the equation ##2r\,dr=-2R\,dx##, which is mentioned as part of a different problem in the text.
  • One participant suggests that the results are based on introductory-level calculus and recommends a textbook for further practice, indicating that familiarity with calculus techniques is necessary for understanding the derivations.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the need for clarification on the mathematical derivations, but there is no consensus on the specific steps or methods to arrive at the results discussed. Confusion remains regarding the differentiation process and its implications.

Contextual Notes

Participants express limitations in their understanding of the differentiation process and how it applies to the equations presented. There is an acknowledgment of the need for practice in calculus to better grasp the concepts involved.

3102
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I'm reading:
http://www.feynmanlectures.caltech.edu/I_13.html#Ch13-S4


1. In the link it says:
##2\pi\rho d\rho## is the area of the ring of the radius ##\rho## and width ##d\rho##, if ##d\rho \ll \rho##.

Why is this true??

2. A bit further down in the text it says:
Since ##r^2 = \rho^2 + a^2##, ##\rho\,d\rho = r\,dr##.

How do you get this result??

3. Even further down, after "But we see that", it says:
##r^2 = ... = a^2 + R^2 - 2Rx## Then: ##2r\,dr=-2R\,dx##

How do you get that?

It would be great if you answered my questions and if you recommended me some book or link that shows how to get these mathematical results.
 
Last edited:
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3102 said:
I'm reading:
http://www.feynmanlectures.caltech.edu/I_13.html#Ch13-S41. In the link it says:
##2\pi\rho d\rho## is the area of the ring of the radius ##\rho## and width ##d\rho##, if ##d\rho \ll \rho##.

Why is this true??
The area of the ring is the difference between the area of a circle with radius ##\rho## and the area of a circle with radius ##\rho+d\rho##; the ring is what's left if I cut the smaller circle out of the bigger circle. The condition that ##d\rho \ll \rho## allows us to ignore the ##(d\rho)^2## terms.

2. A bit further down in the text it says:
Since ##r^2 = \rho^2 + a^2##, ##\rho\,d\rho = r\,dr##.

How do you get this result??
Differentiate both sides with respect to ##\rho##, and a bit of algebra will take you the rest of the way.

3. Even further down, after "But we see that", it says:
##r^2 = ... = a^2 + R^2 - 2Rx## Then: ##2r\,dr=-2R\,dx##

How do you get that?
(Note that Feynman has moved on to a different problem here)
The same trick as in #2 works here.

It would be great if you answered my questions and if you recommended me some book or link that shows how to get these mathematical results.
These results are all based on introductory-level calculus, and any decent intro textbook will give you the necessary background.

However, it takes a fair amount of practice (not hard, just practice) to get to where you can reach into the mathematical toolbox and pull out the right technique without thinking about it. The exercises in a calculus-based but pragmatic mechanics textbook such as Kleppner and Kolenkow would be a good start.
 
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Thanks for your fast and great answer, but unfortunately I don't understand everything.


ad question1) Thanks, I completely understand your advice.

ad question2) I don't understand what's going on here. I've used your advise and differentiated both sides with respect to ##\rho##.
On the right side I've got ##f(\rho)=\rho^2+a^2## this is easy to differentiate: ##f'(\rho)=2\rho##, since ##a^2## is a constant.

The left side isn't that easy: ##f(\rho)=r(\rho)^2##.

$$f'(\rho)=\dfrac{r}{dr}\cdot\dfrac{dr}{d\rho}$$

$$f'(\rho)=1\cdot\dfrac{dr}{d\rho}$$



If I know set both sides together I get: ## 1\cdot\dfrac{dr}{d\rho}=2\rho##. Then I multiply both sides with ##dp## and divide them by ##2##: ##\frac{1}{2} \cdot dr = 2\rho \, d\rho##. This is not the same as ##r\,dr=\rho\,d\rho##. What did I do wrong?

ad question3) I think: If I'm able to understand question2, I will also understand question3.
 
3102 said:
What did I do wrong?

##\frac{d}{d\rho}(r^2) = 2r\frac{dr}{d\rho}##

##\frac{d}{d\rho}(\rho^2+a^2) = 2\rho##
 
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