Thermodynamics: Gradient of Adiabat in PV diagram

Click For Summary
SUMMARY

The discussion revolves around deriving the gradient of an adiabat in a PV diagram using the Equation of State for salt water. The relevant equations include the volume equation \( V = V_{0}(1 + \beta(T - T_{0}) - \gamma(P - P_{0})) \) and the entropy equation \( S = S_{0} + C_{v} \ln(T - T_{0}) + \frac{\beta}{\gamma}(V - V_{0}) \). Participants emphasized the importance of recognizing that for an adiabatic process, the change in entropy \( dS \) equals zero, leading to the expression for the gradient \( \frac{dP}{dV} \). The final derived expression for pressure is \( P = P_{0} + \frac{1}{\gamma{V}} + \frac{\beta}{\gamma{V}}e^{-C_{v}}e^{-\frac{\beta}{\gamma}(V-V_{0})} \).

PREREQUISITES
  • Understanding of thermodynamic concepts, particularly adiabatic processes.
  • Familiarity with the Equation of State for fluids, specifically for salt water.
  • Knowledge of partial derivatives and their application in thermodynamics.
  • Proficiency in using logarithmic functions in thermodynamic equations.
NEXT STEPS
  • Study the derivation of the gradient of an adiabat in various thermodynamic systems.
  • Learn about the implications of the Equation of State in real fluid behavior.
  • Explore the application of partial derivatives in thermodynamic equations.
  • Investigate the significance of entropy in adiabatic processes and its mathematical representation.
USEFUL FOR

Students and professionals in thermodynamics, particularly those studying fluid mechanics and heat transfer, will benefit from this discussion. It is also valuable for researchers working on thermodynamic modeling of salt water and similar fluids.

nobosity
Messages
5
Reaction score
0

Homework Statement



The Equation of State and the expression for the entropy for a sample of salt water is given by:

V = V_{0}(1 + \beta(T - T_{0}) - \gamma(P - P_{0})) S = S_{0} + C_{v}ln(T - T_{0}) + \frac{\beta}{\gamma}(V - V_{0})

where the subscript 0 denotes a reference state, the coefficients \beta and \gamma are constants and C_{v} is the heat capacity of the salt water at constant volume.

Derive an expression for the gradient of an adiabat in a PV diagram.

Homework Equations


Listed above.

The Attempt at a Solution



I struggle to write the attempts I've made trying to answer this question. I understand that in this case we have V(T,P) and S(T,V), the gradient will be (dP/dV) and using the fact that an adiabat occurs when there is no change in heat energy. Also aware of the fact that Cv can be written as a differential in terms of (dU/dT), which is possibly relevant.

The real issue is I have no idea of the best way to put all of this information together and find a logical pathway to answer. Do I want to get to: dP = \frac{\partial{P}}{\partial{T}}dT + \frac{\partial{P}}{\partial{V}}dV and substitute a concoction of the above information to get to the gradient?

Been banging my head against this problem for a couple of weeks, and would be very grateful for someone to point me in the right direction!

EDIT:
Probably should have included that in my explanation. I get that for an adiabatic change, dS is 0 assuming reversibility. Similarly, I got to the point where I have:

dV = \frac{\partial{V}}{\partial{T}}dT + \frac{\partial{V}}{\partial{P}}dP

and

dS = \frac{\partial{S}}{\partial{T}}dT + \frac{\partial{S}}{\partial{V}}dV = 0

However, none of these approaches seems to lead to a place where I can rearrange to get to dP/dV. Thats the part I'm a bit stuck on.
 
Last edited:
Physics news on Phys.org
Construct dV from the first given equation and dS from the second equation. "Adiabatic" tells you something about dS.
 
TSny said:
Construct dV from the first given equation and dS from the second equation. "Adiabatic" tells you something about dS.

Probably should have included that in my explanation. I get that for an adiabatic change, dS is 0 assuming reversibility. Similarly, I got to the point where I have:

dV = \frac{\partial{V}}{\partial{T}}dT + \frac{\partial{V}}{\partial{P}}dP

and

dS = \frac{\partial{S}}{\partial{T}}dT + \frac{\partial{S}}{\partial{V}}dV = 0

However, none of these approaches seems to lead to a place where I can rearrange to get to dP/dV. Thats the part I'm a bit stuck on.Thanks for the reply though.
 
Can you solve your dS equation for dT and sub into the first equation?
 
Solve the S equation for ##T-T_0## and substitute into the V equation. Then take the derivative of P with respect to V at constant S.
 
Chestermiller said:
Solve the S equation for ##T-T_0## and substitute into the V equation. Then take the derivative of P with respect to V at constant S.

So solving dS gives me:

dS = \frac{dT}{T-T_{0}} + \frac{\beta}{\gamma} = 0

and subbing into dV gives:

-\frac{\gamma}{\beta}\frac{dT}{T-T_0} = \frac{\partial{V}}{\partial{T}}dT + \frac{\partial{V}}{\partial{P}}dP

But from here, and I'm probably being thick, I find myself with a lot of differentials and not a lot of directions. Calculating the partials gives:

-\frac{\gamma}{\beta}\frac{dT}{T-T_0} =\beta{V_{0}}dT - \gamma{P_{0}}dP

but then there's no Vs anywhere in sight...
 
nobosity said:
So solving dS gives me:

dS = \frac{dT}{T-T_{0}} + \frac{\beta}{\gamma} = 0

and subbing into dV gives:

-\frac{\gamma}{\beta}\frac{dT}{T-T_0} = \frac{\partial{V}}{\partial{T}}dT + \frac{\partial{V}}{\partial{P}}dP

But from here, and I'm probably being thick, I find myself with a lot of differentials and not a lot of directions. Calculating the partials gives:

-\frac{\gamma}{\beta}\frac{dT}{T-T_0} =\beta{V_{0}}dT - \gamma{P_{0}}dP

but then there's no Vs anywhere in sight...
Who said anything about differentiating the S equation? Not me.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: nobosity
Chestermiller said:
Who said anything about differentiating the S equation? Not me.

It all dawned on me at once, I was leading myself down the garden path. Thanks!
 
Chestermiller said:
Who said anything about differentiating the S equation? Not me.

And just for future reference for anyone who stumbles across a similar problem, I ended up with:

P = P_{0} + \frac{1}{\gamma{V}} + \frac{\beta}{\gamma{V}}e^{-C_{v}}e^{-\frac{\beta}{\gamma}(V-V_{0})}

dP/dV of that should give the slope of the adiabat!
 
  • #10
nobosity said:
It all dawned on me at once, I was leading myself down the garden path.
You have been given two different approaches. My approach is to use the equation for S and the fact that dS = 0 to get an expression for dT in terms of dV. Then when you take the differential of the V equation, you can express it in terms of just the differentials dV and dP. From that you can get an expression for dP/dV in terms of V, P, and T. But you can eliminate T by using the V equation.

The equation that you were given for S doesn't look correct to me. You have a logarithm of the dimensional quantity T- To. The argument of a logarithm is generally dimensionless. Also, the equation for S is undefined at the reference state where T = To. It looks to me that the argument of the logarithm should maybe be T/To. The the equation for S will yield S = So at the reference state.
 

Similar threads

Replies
4
Views
2K
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K
Replies
19
Views
2K
  • · Replies 32 ·
2
Replies
32
Views
3K
Replies
4
Views
1K
Replies
30
Views
4K
Replies
4
Views
755
Replies
10
Views
2K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K