Thermodynamics: ideal gas undergoing an isothermal process

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around an ideal gas undergoing an isothermal process, specifically evaluating certain equations related to quasistatic processes. Participants are examining the implications of isothermal conditions on the provided equations.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification, Assumption checking, Mixed

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants are questioning the applicability of the equations for isothermal processes, particularly regarding the behavior of the constant α and its implications for heat, work, and entropy. There is also exploration of the indeterminate forms that arise in the context of these equations.

Discussion Status

Some participants suggest that the equations may not be suitable for isothermal processes, while others are considering how to evaluate the indeterminate forms that arise. There is an ongoing exploration of the implications of these conditions without a clear consensus on the conclusions.

Contextual Notes

Participants are grappling with the definitions and relationships between specific heat capacities (C, Cp, Cv) and their behavior as temperature approaches zero in the context of isothermal processes. There is a recognition of the potential for conflicting interpretations of the equations provided.

atlantic
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Homework Statement



For an ideal gas, undergoing a quasistatic process, the equations below are correct. Evaluate them given that we have an isothermal process

Homework Equations



PV^\alpha=K where K is a constant and \alpha=C-C_P/C-C_V

W = \frac{K}{\alpha -1} (\frac{1}{V_f^{\alpha-1}}-\frac{1}{V_i^{\alpha-1}})
Q = C(T_f -T_i)
\Delta S= Cln\frac{T_f}{T_i}



The Attempt at a Solution


For an isothermal process, ΔT = 0, but what does that mean for the equations given? First I though it would mean that C→∞, but that would mean that Q=0 and W→∞ (because \alpha→1), which clearly is not correct.

How should I argue?
 
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Or does these equations not apply for isothermal processes?
 
atlantic said:

Homework Statement



For an ideal gas, undergoing a quasistatic process, the equations below are correct. Evaluate them given that we have an isothermal process

Homework Equations



PV^\alpha=K where K is a constant and \alpha=C-C_P/C-C_V
This looks wrong. For example, if it's an isothermal process, α = 1 but then (C-Cp)/(C-Cv) = 1 or Cp = Cv which is definitely not true for an ideal gas.
 
rude man said:
This looks wrong. For example, if it's an isothermal process, α = 1 but then (C-Cp)/(C-Cv) = 1 or Cp = Cv which is definitely not true for an ideal gas.

I though α=1 because C→∞ (C=Q/dT, where dT→0)?

Anyways, I'm thinking that these equations are not good to use when the process is isothermal, as the equations for the work, heat and entropy becomes of the type: ∞ muliplied with 0. Do you think this is a good conclusion?
 
The point of the problem might be to figure out how these indeterminate forms can be evaluated and to show the result is what you'd expect for an isothermal process.
 

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