Time period of block springs SHM

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the time period of a block attached to springs undergoing simple harmonic motion (SHM). Participants are exploring the relationship between the displacement of the block and the change in length of the springs when the block is pushed towards a point.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Assumption checking, Mathematical reasoning

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the application of the cosine rule to relate the displacement of the block to the change in spring length. There are attempts to clarify the use of small angle approximations and the implications of using different approximations for cosine.

Discussion Status

The discussion is active, with participants questioning the validity of their assumptions and exploring alternative approaches. Some guidance has been offered regarding the geometric interpretation of the problem, particularly in relation to the formation of a right triangle.

Contextual Notes

There is an emphasis on the small angle approximation, and participants are navigating the complexities of applying this approximation correctly in the context of the problem. The problem is noted to be challenging, as indicated by the original poster.

Jahnavi
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Homework Statement


Springs.png


Homework Equations

The Attempt at a Solution



Length of the unstretched springs is L .Suppose block is pushed towards C by a small distance x . This causes a change in length of springs B and C . Their new length is L+∆L .Consider spring B. If the new length makes a small angle θ with the vertical .

I need to find relation between ∆L and x .

Applying cosine rule ,

x2 = (L+∆L)2 + L2 -2L(L+∆L)cosθ

For small angles , cosθ≈1.

Using this I get ∆L = x .

This is not correct . What is the mistake ?
 

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Jahnavi said:
For small angles , cosθ≈1.
Perhaps that is not exact enough here.
How about applying the cosine rule using the known angle?
 
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haruspex said:
Perhaps that is not exact enough here.

Could you explain what do you mean by this .

Should I use cosθ ≈ 1-θ2/2 , but then what value should I put for θ ?
 
Jahnavi said:
Should I use cosθ ≈ 1-θ2/2
Yes, but as you say the result is unhelpful, so why not try the alternative I suggested.
 
haruspex said:
How about applying the cosine rule using the known angle?

That does give correct result :smile: Thank you .

This is one of the tougher problems in the book and the hint along with question is to use small angle approximation . This is why I used angle θ as it seemed to be the only small angle in the triangle formed .

If you can think of some why how to use small angle approximation , please let me know .
 
Last edited:
Jahnavi said:
how to use small angle approximation
No, it does not seem useful here.
A simpler way is to drop a perpendicular from the original position of the mass to a stretched spring and observe that this produces a roughly 45-45-90 triangle with x as the hypotenuse and ΔL on each of the other sides.
 
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haruspex said:
A simpler way is to drop a perpendicular from the original position of the mass to a stretched spring and observe that this produces a roughly 45-45-90 triangle with x as the hypotenuse and ΔL on each of the other sides.

This is so good :smile:

How did you get this ? It is not obvious to me . How is length of the perpendicular ∆L (or how are the two angles 45° each ) ?
 
Last edited:
Jahnavi said:
This is so good :smile:

How did you get this ? It is not obvious to me . How is length of the perpendicular ∆L (or how are the two angles 45° each ) ?
The perpendicular will meet the stretched spring roughly L from the spring's anchor point, leaving ΔL on the other side, from the perpendicular to the mass. Since that small triangle is nearly isosceles, the perpendicular itself is length ΔL.
 
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haruspex said:
The perpendicular will meet the stretched spring roughly L from the spring's anchor point,

How ?

haruspex said:
Since that small triangle is nearly isosceles,

How ?
 
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haruspex said:
The perpendicular will meet the stretched spring roughly L from the spring's anchor point
To be exact, L cos(θ) ≈ L.
haruspex said:
Since that small triangle is nearly isosceles
Angles are 90, 45-θ, 45+θ.
 
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  • #11
haruspex said:
To be exact, L cos(θ) ≈ L.

Angles are 90, 45-θ, 45+θ.

OK . Thanks :smile:
 

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