Topology - How do they know this is open?

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around a lemma in topology concerning the compactness of the product space A x {x_0} where A is a compact subset of R^n and x_0 is a point in R^m. Participants are examining the nature of open covers and the projection of open sets in product topologies.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification, Assumption checking, Mathematical reasoning

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants question how the projection of an open cover from A x {x_0} to A can be guaranteed to be open. There is a counterexample presented to challenge the assumption that the associated set V is open. Some participants explore the necessity of introducing additional open sets to support their reasoning.

Discussion Status

The discussion is active, with participants exploring different interpretations of the problem. Some have proposed reasoning involving open sets in R^n and R^m, while others have raised concerns about the validity of these projections. There is no explicit consensus, but various lines of reasoning are being examined.

Contextual Notes

Participants are working under the constraints of a homework assignment, which may limit the depth of exploration. There is an ongoing debate about the implications of the definitions of open sets in product spaces.

quasar987
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Homework Statement


The lemma sets out to show that if A in R^n is compact and x_0 is in R^m, then A x {x_0} is compact in R^n x R^m.

They say, "Let [itex]\mathcal{U}[/itex] be an open cover of A x {x_0} and

[tex]\mathcal{V}=\{V\subset \mathbb{R}^n:V=\{y:(y,x_0)\in U\}, \ \mbox{for some} \ U\in \mathcal{U}\}[/tex]

Then [itex]\mathcal{V}[/itex] is an open cover of A."

How do they know that given some U in [itex]\mathcal{U}[/itex], the associated V is open?

Edit: In fact, consider the following counter example: Let n=m=1, A=[-½,½], x_0=0. Then A x {x_0} is just the segment [-½,½] considered in the R² plane. Let [itex]\mathcal{U}=\{B_n(0,0)\}_{n\in\mathbb{N}}[/itex] (the collection of open balls centered on the origin of radius n). Then, let V_n be the set V associated with B_n(0,0) as described above, i.e. [itex]V_n=\{y\in\mathbb{R}:(y,0)\in B_n(0,0)\}[/itex]=[-½,½], a set that is not open in R. ah!
 
Last edited:
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V_n = (-n, n)

V_n [itex]\cap[/itex] A = [-1/2, 1/2] (for n>0)
 
Hm, yes. ":frown:" I wish I were smarter than the book.

Meanwhile I think I found the answer. Given an U and it's associated V, for any point y in V, there is an open set O_y in R^n and another one O'_y in R^m such that (y,x_0) is in O_y x O'_y and O_y x O'_y [itex]\subset[/itex] U. And actually, we can write

[tex]V=\bigcup_{y\in V}O_y[/tex]

which is open as an arbitrary union of opens.
 
Why are you introducing O_y's? If curly(U) is some cover of A x {x}, then projecting into the first coordinate gives an open cover of A, take a finite subcover, and pull back.
 
I'm introducing the O_y because otherwise, I was not convinced that the projection was open.

After all, as far as I understand, if U is open in a topological space X x Y, it does not mean that it can be written as the product of an open of X with an open of Y.
 
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