Troubling Coverage of the Fort Hood Shootings

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In summary: Period. In summary, Newsweek suggests that the stress of being in military may have been a motive for the slaughter at Fort Hood, while CNN points to the impact of trauma on those who help the traumatized. CBS and Fox News discuss the religious extremism angle.
  • #36
russ_watters said:
...) and if it is true that he was pushed over the edge by harassment, it's still an Islamic extremist motive! The discussion could then be about: could harassing a person because of perceived Islamic extremism turn a person into an Islamic extremist? That would be an interesting discussion!

And if a man cracks under harassment and goes berserk killing his brethren, and this man happens to be a christian, we do have then a "Christian extremist motive" ? What is the determinant factor ? Religion or harassment ?
 
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  • #37
DanP said:
Yes, but press is not the best way for anyone to get the data.
So unless you have data derived directly from the criminal investigation and not CNN/ whatever the best course for now is not to jump at conclusions.

a) It is the MEDIA that has jumped to conclusions, namely that "this have absolutely nothing to do with Islam, nothing to do with extremism, he was BULLIED, HARASSED, and his parents were dead.

b) Data provided by the media need not be inaccurate, and can be used, in a rational manner, to construct a probability distribution model over possible motives, obviously sensitive to further information gathering.
 
  • #38
DanP said:
And if a man cracks under harassment and goes berserk killing his brethren, and this man happens to be a christian, we do have then a "Christian extremist motive" ? What is the determinant factor ? Religion or harassment ?

How many Christian terrorist organizations do you know of?

Attempted and executed terrorist plots?

Compare that to the number of muslim terrorist activities, and try to achieve the rational conclusion that while the Nidal Hasan event might well be an Islamic extremist action, whereas in the case of this fantasy Christian individual of yours it would be extremely UNLIKELY that it was Christian extremism behind it (unless it takes place in say, Congo, Southern Sudan or Northern Ireland, where that hypothesis has some plausibility).
 
  • #39
arildno said:
a) It is the MEDIA that has jumped to conclusions, namely that "this have absolutely nothing to do with Islam, nothing to do with extremism, he was BULLIED, HARASSED, and his parents were dead.

Media is driven by money. Theyll do anything for better ratings , and in some cases even to manipul;ate masses according with political view of divisional factors.

I any even, even if the coverage is "sensationalistic" there is no need to fall in the other extreme and prefer "terrorist" coverages

b) Data provided by the media need not be inaccurate, and can be used, in a rational manner, to construct a probability distribution model over possible motives, obviously sensitive to further information gathering.[/QUOTE]

Key words "need not be inaccurate" also , need not to be accurate
Key words "further information gathering".
 
  • #40
Astronuc said:
It could be a case that Hasan just lost it. Why? We don't know. We do know that he was apparently a devout Muslim. He was apparently socially isolated. He was apparently distressed about his deployment. He was apparently angry to the point of rage where he lost control. That does not make his action terrorism.
It seems to me that people often try to find rationalizations for their aggressive and antisocial feelings when they are stressed or emotionally disturbed. As already noted we can likely consider most violent extremists to be mentally or emotionally imbalanced. Many terrorists, muslim or otherwise, have most likely experienced some loss or stress which has influenced them to follow the path they have chosen. Evidence would seem to indicate that Hasan was making similar rationalizations for apparent antisocial attitudes. The theory that he was suffering from some sort of stress and lost control does not preclude a desire to commit a terrorist act against the people whom he apparently saw as the source of his emotional disturbance.

Some people are concerned that PC attitudes made Hasan's colleagues reticent to report and act on apparent warning signs of his break down. So many of these people also feel that the general lack of attention by the media to these warning signs, categorizing the attack as a sudden and inexplicable mental break down, is further evidence that PC attitudes are preventing people from attending the obvious.
 
  • #41
While I have allueded to what I think his motivation was, I haven't directly explained it. Here it is (note, this is a mixture of the known facts and speculation about motive):

Hasan was born in the US to Palestinian (note: I'm not sure what is actually meant by "Palestinian", since there is no such country) parents, both now dead. He is a devout Muslim. Joining the US military for reasons I can only imagine, he spends most of his time in school where the reality of what the US military is about doesn't need to concern him. After 9/11, things become much more real for him. Osama Bin Laden states that he is engaged in nothing less than a holy war between Islam and the West. As a devout Muslim, this troubles Hasan. He doesn't want a holy war and doesn't want the US military being active against Muslims.

Then troops start coming back from overseas - troops who have heard and responded to rhetoric from both sides about this being a holy war - troops who'se feelings have been amplified by being shot at. It is Hasan's job to counsel these men. Instead he engages them in debate about the rightousness of their actions. They get fired up, he gets fired up. He starts posting on internet forums, showing sympathy toward the 9/11 terrorists and using other increasingly elevated ant-US rhetoric. He wants out of the army, but can't leave because his years of army provided schooling require years of service to pay for it.

His performace as an officer in the US Army and counselor suffers. He receives bad performance evaluations. The Army needs warm bodies and doesn't want to separate him. His CO doesn't want to be seen as anti-Muslim. His CO does the expedient thing: he transfers him, making him someone else's problem. And not only that, he transfers him to a deployable unit! Well if anything is going to push a budding Islamic extremist over the edge, it is the threat of being deployed to the Middle East to be part of the forces engaged in the "Holy War" against his religion! He finally snaps and crosses the line from extremist to terrorist, committing murder for the purpose of making a religious/political statement - turning his fanatical anti-US/anti-infidel opinions into actions.
 
  • #42
russ_watters said:
While that really is the reason I started the thread, a much more serioius implication just occurred to me:

Perhaps the cause of the media's aversion to engaging the issue of Islamic extremism is related to the military's apparent failure to properly engage the issue of Islamic extremism here! Perhaps the PC culture (if that is what is causing it) that has the media ignoring the issue is also what caused the military to fail to react to the warning signs Hasan gave them.
You got there before me damn it.
 
  • #43
DanP said:
Yes, but press is not the best way for anyone to get the data.

So unless you have data derived directly from the criminal investigation and not CNN/ whatever the best course for now is not to jump at conclusions. It may be terrorism. It may be another thing. We don't know. At least not yet.
How does that make it OK for CNN to investigate and forward one theory but not the other, when evidence they have access to points to the other?

And I don't buy for a second that people are capable of sitting back and not forminig opinions. That's not how the human brain works. The human brain searches for reasons for things happening - that's what motivates our quest for knowledge!
 
  • #44
DanP said:
Media is driven by money. Theyll do anything for better ratings , and in some cases even to manipul;ate masses according with political view of divisional factors.

I any even, even if the coverage is "sensationalistic" there is no need to fall in the other extreme and prefer "terrorist" coverages

b) Data provided by the media need not be inaccurate, and can be used, in a rational manner, to construct a probability distribution model over possible motives, obviously sensitive to further information gathering.

Key words "need not be inaccurate" also , need not to be accurate
Key words "further information gathering".[/QUOTE]

There's nothing irrational to construct probability models on basis of a few putative facts.

What IS irrational is
a) the unwillingness to take new info into the models as it appears
b) A dogmatic refusal to recognize the possibility that this incident might have something to do with N.H's religious views.
 
  • #45
arildno said:
How many Christian terrorist organizations do you know of?

Attempted and executed terrorist plots?

Compare that to the number of muslim terrorist activities, and try to achieve the rational conclusion that while the Nidal Hasan event might well be an Islamic extremist action, whereas in the case of this fantasy Christian individual of yours it would be extremely UNLIKELY that it was Christian extremism behind it (unless it takes place in say, Congo, Southern Sudan or Northern Ireland, where that hypothesis has some plausibility).

I can't see any rational conclusions could be derived from the number of terrorist organizations and Nidal case. Emotional ones, yes.
 
  • #46
arildno said:
a) the unwillingness to take new info into the models as it appears
b) A dogmatic refusal to recognize the possibility that this incident might have something to do with N.H's religious views.
Those holds very well in reverse as well.

I.e: A dogmatic refusal to recognize the possibility that this incident might *not* have something to do with N.H's religious viewsIt's simply to few data to jump on conclusions. Unless you are part of the criminal investigation and you didn't told us that.
 
  • #47
His performace as an officer in the US Army and counselor suffers. He receives bad performance evaluations. The Army needs warm bodies and doesn't want to separate him. His CO doesn't want to be seen as anti-Muslim. His CO does the expedient thing: he transfers him, making him someone else's problem.

A problem with this, russ, is that his promotion to Major occurred as late as May 2009, as I have already mentioned.

His career was flying, having participated in a Homeland Security seminar the previous year.
 
  • #48
DanP said:
Those holds very well in reverse as well.

I.e: A dogmatic refusal to recognize the possibility that this incident might *not* have something to do with N.H's religious views
.

Neither Russ, me or anyone else have done anything like that.

In contrast to you and other leftists.
 
  • #49
TheStatutoryApe said:
It seems to me that people often try to find rationalizations for their aggressive and antisocial feelings when they are stressed or emotionally disturbed. As already noted we can likely consider most violent extremists to be mentally or emotionally imbalanced. Many terrorists, muslim or otherwise, have most likely experienced some loss or stress which has influenced them to follow the path they have chosen. Evidence would seem to indicate that Hasan was making similar rationalizations for apparent antisocial attitudes. The theory that he was suffering from some sort of stress and lost control does not preclude a desire to commit a terrorist act against the people whom he apparently saw as the source of his emotional disturbance. [emphasis added]
Yes, that is something I've argued around, but not explained as well as you just did. There are many paths toward becoming a terrorist or mass murderer and being teased/taunted into it is one of them. But that is part of the Islamic extremist motive, not separate from it. The media is saying he was taunted in an apologetic way and not discussing it as part of an Islamic terrorist motive.
 
  • #50
russ_watters said:
Who's assertions? Mine? I never made such assertions as Lisa is disputing.

The key assertion.
We have very strong indications that this was an act of Islamic extremist terrorism . . . .
I'm looking at the legal definition of "terrorism". Was Hasan tyring to obtain a political objective using violence, or did he just flip out and go on a rampage - just like Timothy McVeigh flipped out and blew up a Federal building? Was McVeigh's act an act of Christian terrorism?

What has Hasan written that would indicate that he was religiously motivated to embark on a killing spree?

There appear to be a number of news articles that discuss Hasan and his religious background. But they are being careful not to automatically link Islam (Islamic) with extremism or terrorism.

As for
Furthermore, even as late as January 2009, Nidal Hasan had, according to WorldNetDaily, the honor of having served as a Task Force participant associated with "Homeland Security Policy Institute at George Washington University ":
Corsi hangs his entire allegation on a document produced on May 19, 2009 by The George Washington University Homeland Security Policy Institute entitled "Thinking Anew, Security Priorities For The Next Administration." In that document, Nidal Hasan is listed, on page 29, as a "Task Force Event Participant." He was one of hundreds of people listed as a "participant."

Read more at: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/11/06/iwndis-jerome-corsi-claim_n_348461.html&cp


Of course what Hasan did is extremist, and it has elements of terroism, namely violence and homicide. But it's not yet clear what motivated him.
 
  • #51
arildno said:
In contrast to you and other leftists.


Another purely emotional statement. You know nothing about my political views. I would very grateful to you if you stick to rationality and not pure emotions. I can understand the huge emotional load of the incident, but frankly ... you are not to label ppl. I hope I made myself very clear.
 
  • #52
russ_watters said:
Intellectual honesty. A news service is supposed to report the news. If an act is motivated by PTSD, they should report the act is motivated by PTSD. If an act is motivated by religious fanaticism, they should report that it is motivated by religious fanatacism.

There are not enough evidences so they should just stay neutral IMO.

1) There are quite a few Muslims in the US, people who have Middle Eastern names (even though they are not religious), and people who look like Muslims
2) In the past, there had been some incidents where people who look like/are muslims were attacked (few). There have been many other cases where Americans had irrational phobia of all Muslims/Muslims names.
3) If media goes and blames straight the religion, I can expect the voilence incidents or undesired discrimation against all Muslims/people with muslim names.

So, I think media is doing good job in preventing number 2.

I've made no statement whatsoever about Islam in general. The only mudslinging I'm doing here is aimed at the news media!

I was talking about the posts by everyone (not you).
 
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  • #53
arildno said:
A problem with this, russ, is that his promotion to Major occurred as late as May 2009, as I have already mentioned.

His career was flying, having participated in a Homeland Security seminar the previous year. [emphasis added]
I'm not so sure that's true. As an officer, your first two promotions are scheduled - essentially guaranteed. They happen automatically unless there is an extreme reason to deny them to you. Your third promotion (to major) is not guaranteed, but happens at a particular time. Every 6 months or a year (can't remember which), batches of eligible candidates are promoted. If the needs of the military and availiability of candiates in your field are right for you, you may get promoted with less than stellar performance evaluations.

That is, assuming such complaints even made it into his performace evauations!

By the way - that's April 2008, not 2009. http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,572509,00.html
 
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  • #54
russ_watters said:
I'm not so sure that's true. As an officer, your first two promotions are scheduled - essentially guaranteed. They happen automatically unless there is an extreme reason to deny them to you. Your third promotion (to major) is not guaranteed, but happens at a particular time. Every 6 months or a year (can't remember which), batches of eligible candidates are promoted. If the needs of the military and availiability of candiates in your field are right for you, you may get promoted with less than stellar performance evaluations.
Thanks for this update.


By the way - that's April 2008, not 2009. http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,572509,00.html[/QUOTE]
Okay, then the biography as given i Washington Post was a bit unclear on that issue.

His promotion seems then to have happened directly prior to his engagement in the Homeland Security Task Force?
 
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  • #55
arildno said:
How many Christian terrorist organizations do you know of?

Attempted and executed terrorist plots?

Compare that to the number of muslim terrorist activities, and try to achieve the rational conclusion that while the Nidal Hasan event might well be an Islamic extremist action, whereas in the case of this fantasy Christian individual of yours it would be extremely UNLIKELY that it was Christian extremism behind it (unless it takes place in say, Congo, Southern Sudan or Northern Ireland, where that hypothesis has some plausibility).

There are several militant organizations in the US that identify themselves as christian and could rightly be labeled as christian extremists. Activities such as abortion clinic bombings and lynchings are easily terrorist activities (and our intelligence community certainly takes domestic terrorism of any stripe seriously) so we could likely figure that terrorism by christian extremists is more prevalent in the US than muslim terrorism.

Since our population is mostly christian simply being christian is hardly evidence enough to prioritize any theories that a violent crime is terrorism. Of course if the christian has previously made statements supporting extremist organizations that identify themselves as christian and perhaps uses some sort of christian slogan de guerre before committing the violent act I doubt anyone would hesitate to speculate on the persons motivations.
 
  • #56
According to the biography in Washington Post, Hasan enlisted in the Army after high school (probably ~ 1988), so he's been in the Army for about 20 years before he flipped out.

I did hear a colonel or general indicating that the Army is going to have to look at how the Army missed possible warning signs.

The WP reported -
The Associated Press reported that Hasan attracted the attention of law enforcement authorities in recent months after an Internet posting under the screen name "NidalHasan" compared Islamic suicide bombers to Japanese kamikaze pilots. "To say that this soldier committed suicide is inappropriate," the posting read. "It's more appropriate to say he is a brave hero that sacrificed his life for a more noble cause."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/11/06/AR2009110600907_2.html
I presume the authorities will review Hasan's writings in order to develop a psychological profile, as well as looking for clues indicating his motivations.
 
  • #57
Astronuc said:
The WP reported - I presume the authorities will review Hasan's writings in order to develop a psychological profile, as well as looking for clues indicating his motivations.

Its the only sensible thing to do.
 
  • #58
DanP said:
I can understand the huge emotional load of the incident...
Arildno is not American, I doubt he feels any great emotional load over this incident beyond what he would feel for any group of innocent people mowed down by gunfire (though Arildno may have preferred I not inform you so that he could see if you would continue misinformed comments while chastising him for making misinformed comments ;-)).


By the way I know a DanPratt, would you happen to be she?
 
  • #59
TheStatutoryApe said:
Arildno is not American, I doubt he feels any great emotional load over this incident beyond what he would feel for any group of innocent people mowed down by gunfire (though Arildno may have preferred I not inform you so that he could see if you would continue misinformed comments while chastising him for making misinformed comments ;-)).By the way I know a DanPratt, would you happen to be she?

No, sorry, I am a not she.

Frankly, I couldn't care less Arialdno is an American or not and what he prefers. I am not chastising him for making misinformed comments, but emotional ones. The term "chastising" is too strong, I am actually having fun reading his comments.
 
  • #60
TheStatutoryApe said:
There are several militant organizations in the US that identify themselves as christian and could rightly be labeled as christian extremists. Activities such as abortion clinic bombings and lynchings are easily terrorist activities (and our intelligence community certainly takes domestic terrorism of any stripe seriously) so we could likely figure that terrorism by christian extremists is more prevalent in the US than muslim terrorism.

Since our population is mostly christian simply being christian is hardly evidence enough to prioritize any theories that a violent crime is terrorism. Of course if the christian has previously made statements supporting extremist organizations that identify themselves as christian and perhaps uses some sort of christian slogan de guerre before committing the violent act I doubt anyone would hesitate to speculate on the persons motivations.

True enough, mea culpa. I had a bit too European angle on this, where Christian extremism is largely confined to Northern Ireland.

We had a case of a sect of puritanical, newly converted Laplanders in 1856 here in Norway, where the local priest and law enforcement agent were murdered.

But, it is, admittedly, some time ago..
 
  • #61
russ_watters said:
I'm not so sure that's true. As an officer, your first two promotions are scheduled - essentially guaranteed. They happen automatically unless there is an extreme reason to deny them to you. Your third promotion (to major) is not guaranteed, but happens at a particular time. Every 6 months or a year (can't remember which), batches of eligible candidates are promoted. If the needs of the military and availiability of candiates in your field are right for you, you may get promoted with less than stellar performance evaluations.

That is, assuming such complaints even made it into his performace evauations!

By the way - that's April 2008, not 2009. http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,572509,00.html

What IS odd, is that he was evidently under some sort of supervision since at least March 2009, on account of disturbing personality tendencies.

I would have thought that as an officer, security clearances to serve in action would be particularly strict.

Thus, unless he just recently received some sort of dismissal from active duty in Afghanistan, it seems odd that the military seriously considered him as viable personell in a high-risk situation exacerbated, possibly, with uncertainties as to where his loyalty would be.


Perhaps he just prior to the massacre was informed that he was ineligible for duty, and that enraged, he took revenge?

Not that this motive need to have been unconnected from additional Islamic extremist views..
 
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  • #62
DanP said:
Im actually having fun reading his comments.
Arildno is entertaining when he gets haughty.

arildno said:
I had a bit too European angle on this, where Christian extremism is largely confined to Northern Ireland.
Do you think that cultural/national enmity from so many different countries so close together sort of masks or dilutes the sort of racial and religious extremism we see here in the US having a large homogeneous culture? It has always seemed to me that cultural/national rivalry is probably a much more prevalent (and perhaps more acceptable) outlet for such tendencies in Europe, assuming that some people simply have a psychological need to be zenophobic or elitist.
 
  • #63
russ_watters said:
As an officer, your first two promotions are scheduled - essentially guaranteed. They happen automatically unless there is an extreme reason to deny them to you.

I knew a guy who spent six years as an O-1. The military came to the conclusion that the best service he could provide would be to serve as a negative example to others.

russ_watters said:
Your third promotion (to major) is not guaranteed, but happens at a particular time. Every 6 months or a year (can't remember which), batches of eligible candidates are promoted. If the needs of the military and availiability of candiates in your field are right for you, you may get promoted with less than stellar performance evaluations.

The situation here is a little different. Hasan was a medical doctor, which means he was commissioned an O-3. Above O-3 promotions are not guaranteed, but if you are passed over too often, you have to separate or retire. The effect of that is that officers who are less than stellar but not bad enough to fire get promoted.
 
  • #64
Astronuc said:
...Name-calling is just one manifestation of harrassment. Hasan was a major, but presumably he started at a lower rank and moved up to major.
A doctor starts out as a Captain or equivalent in the service.
During his time in the military, he was harrassed, and apparently after 9/11/01, the harrassment was primarily because he was Muslim.
We only have Hasan's assertion that he was harassed.
 
  • #65
arildno said:
The Washington Post has a biography of Maj. Hasan here:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/11/06/AR2009110601978.html

1. Apparently, he got his promotion to Major in May 2009 (as a reward for his work as a Task Force Participant??)
While promotion to Major is not automatic per policy, it is essentially unwritten policy to automatically promote to Major in most Army branches (USMC is different), unless there's some significant black mark on the record, a clearly demonstrable under performance of some kind. In fact, it's likely Hasan's CO would have undergone scrutiny for NOT passing him forward. The real merit based promotions don't start until Lt Colonel in the Army.
 
  • #66
Vanadium 50 said:
I knew a guy who spent six years as an O-1. The military came to the conclusion that the best service he could provide would be to serve as a negative example to others.
That is extremely odd. Generally the rule is two pass overs at review time and it is pack your bags time.
 
  • #67
TheStatutoryApe said:
Arildno is entertaining when he gets haughty.


Do you think that cultural/national enmity from so many different countries so close together sort of masks or dilutes the sort of racial and religious extremism we see here in the US having a large homogeneous culture? It has always seemed to me that cultural/national rivalry is probably a much more prevalent (and perhaps more acceptable) outlet for such tendencies in Europe, assuming that some people simply have a psychological need to be zenophobic or elitist.
Possibly.

On the other hand, I think that the relative prevalence of "extremist congregrations" in the US, compared to Europe has much to do with that in a sense, such congregations are more "viable" in the US, due to a couple of structural reasons:

1. The welfare state
In most European countries, we pay charity by means of our tax bill, rather than through private channels. Thus, one of the pillars upon which the respectability of the faith communities rests in the US (and for that matter, the network of mosques in Islamic countries) has become undermined.
Whereas in the US, charity as organized through the local churches is one of the MAJOR ways in which people get an outlet for their altruism, Europeans think they have done enough by paying their taxes instead. The church is NOT in Europe, "a community of The Good", rather, it is primarily "a community of The Believers", and that's a difference.

Thus, extremely conservative church communities may well gain respectability in the US by being sincerely devoted to charitable issues, whereas that won't happen here in Europe.

2. State Church, and state funding
a) In Europe, the church hierarchy is STRONG, and receives a lot of funding from the state.
Through that mechanism, secular politicians have a handle on what the church's policy "ought to be". In Norway, for example, bishops have been installed because they were liberal with respect to gay/lesbian issues, more than out of "clerical merits".
Thus, contemporary ideas may gain ground faster in religious establishment institutions in Europe than in large communities in the US (there, new ideas will be the hallmark of "fledgling communities", who will try to carve out a new niche in the marketplace of faith communities)

b) To take the case of Norway, non-establishment faith communities get state funding, roughly in accordance with numbers of members.
Since people dread to lose what they've already got, the presence of state funding might well make some communities loath at developing a confrontational reactionary stance towards the "benevolent" Mother State, in fear of having those money withdrawn.

c) Since most faith communities DO get means from the State, why should individuals bother to pay for the maintenance of a particular faith community?
One joins, instead, a community that provides its religious services "for free", and where the individual member is NOT called upon to make donations.
And thus, extremist groups might not evolve away from the single, fringe lunatic into a full-blown extremist community.
 
  • #68
I don't think that this individual had any motive to create terror within the public at all... From everything I've read about him he just seemed like a very angry indiviudal mad at life and the things he was going to have to do. So what?

If the media starts to portray him as a terrorist then I think that'll be more of the MEDIA doing the terrorizing than anything. I'm certain people thinking terrorist are organizing attacks against American troops on American soil right in their own bases is pretty frightening, espeically when it's uneccessary.
 
  • #69
Some new information.

Muslim leader had troubling talks with suspect

A former classmate has said Hasan was a "vociferous opponent of the war" and "viewed the war against terror" as a "war against Islam." Dr. Val Finnell, who attended a master's in public health program in 2007-2008 at Uniformed Services University with Hasan, said he told classmates he was "a Muslim first and an American second."

"In retrospect, I'm not surprised he did it," Finnell said. "I had real questions about what his priorities were, what his beliefs were."

Osman Danquah, co-founder of the Islamic Community of Greater Killeen, said he was disturbed by Maj. Nidal Malik Hasan's persistent questioning and recommended the mosque reject Hasan's request to become a lay Muslim leader at the sprawling Army post.

Danquah said Hasan never expressed anger toward the Army or indicated any plans for violence, but during the second of two conversations they had over the summer, Hasan seemed almost incoherent, he said.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20091107/ap_on_re_us/us_fort_hood_shooting;_ylt=AuIbOKJ6JMq.ud2UnacYU3RTsa8F;_ylu=X3oDMTNhZTdzN2N1BGFzc2V0A2FwLzIwMDkxMTA3L3VzX2ZvcnRfaG9vZF9zaG9vdGluZwRjY29kZQNtb3N0cG9wdWxhcgRjcG9zAzIEcG9zAzIEc2VjA3luX3RvcF9zdG9yaWVzBHNsawNtdXNsaW1sZWFkZXI-
 
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  • #70
Sorry! said:
I don't think that this individual had any motive to create terror within the public at all... From everything I've read about him he just seemed like a very angry indiviudal mad at life and the things he was going to have to do. So what?
So that's why he shouted "Allahu Akbar" during his rampage?
 

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