Understanding Light: Wave to Particle

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    Light Particle Wave
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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the nature of light, specifically the duality of light as both a wave and a particle. Participants explore the implications of this duality, particularly how concepts like frequency and wavelength relate to photons as discrete packets of energy. The conversation touches on theoretical interpretations and the challenges of reconciling different frameworks of understanding light.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions how to quantitatively relate frequency and wavelength to photons, suggesting a potential "reverse de Broglie wavelength" approach but expressing uncertainty about its validity.
  • Another participant argues that photons are defined in an energy base rather than a spatial coordinate base, raising questions about the comparison of these concepts.
  • There is a discussion about whether photons can be considered point particles with no area or volume, with one participant suggesting that this is not an obvious conclusion solely based on the nature of light.
  • The photoelectric effect is mentioned as a potential basis for understanding the particle nature of light, although the participant expresses uncertainty about the relevance of this example.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the relationship between the wave and particle descriptions of light, with no consensus reached on how to reconcile these perspectives or the implications for understanding photons.

Contextual Notes

The discussion includes assumptions about the definitions of energy and spatial properties, as well as the implications of viewing photons as point particles. These assumptions remain unresolved, and the relationship between wave and particle descriptions is not definitively established.

FunkyDwarf
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Hey guys,

Been a while since i posted here or did any physics/maths (on holidays from uni atm, between 1st and 2nd year of physics major) but i have a quick question, which might infact be flawed in itself but we shall see.

People think of light as a never ending wave, which we were shown by Einstine is false as light moves and exists in discrete packets, photons. I can accept that, and we must if particle physics is to work. However what i have trouble with is translating what is not just a convienience but an actual quantatative measure, ie frequency/wavelength, into the realm of the photon as a particle. At first i thought perhaps you could do a sort of 'reverse debroglie wavelength' but that would be false as that, as far as i know, is linked to the probability of finding a particle and is not an actual inherint property of it.

Hope this made sense!
Thanks
-G
 
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FunkyDwarf said:
People think of light as a never ending wave,

Nothing in life is "never ending" :wink:

which we were shown by Einstine is false as light moves and exists in discrete packets, photons.
Why is there a flaw ? The discrete energy packets we call photons are defined in an energy base, not a spatial coordinate base (like an Euclidean frame of reference for example) in which the "never ending wave" is expressed. How can you compare such two equivalent concepts that are defined with respect to different bases ?

marlon
 
I know nothing in life is never ending, which is why afterwards i said it was false.

What do you mean by defined in an energy base? Are you saying its some non-spacial property?

-G
 
FunkyDwarf said:
I know nothing in life is never ending, which is why afterwards i said it was false.
But the reason you quoted for that to be false is incorrect. You said that the never ending wave is false because : "light moves and exists in discrete packets, photons". This is incorrect because you cannot compare these two concepts for the reasons i explained in my first post.

What do you mean by defined in an energy base?

Photons are chunks of energy or discrete values of energy. If you would plot these values in a graph, the photons would be points on that graph. So, when the base is "discrete energy values", the photons are just point particles.

Are you saying its some non-spacial property?

-G

That is exactly what i am saying.

marlon
 
Right, so that would explain why a photon is a point particle with no area/volume? (i mean aside from this being obvious due to the fact its light)

Thanks
-G
 
FunkyDwarf said:
Right, so that would explain why a photon is a point particle with no area/volume? (i mean aside from this being obvious due to the fact its light)

Thanks
-G

I wouldn't say that because of the nature of light, it is obvious that photons are a point particle. Tell me, how can you deduce this from only looking at light ?

marlon
 
Last edited:
The photoelectric effect i guess (not sure i understand the question however)

-G
 

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