Understanding the Physical Meaning of Divergence and Curl in Vector Fields

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Discussion Overview

The discussion focuses on the physical meaning of divergence and curl in vector fields, exploring their interpretations and implications in various contexts, particularly in fluid dynamics and their relevance to equations like Maxwell's equations. The conversation includes theoretical and conceptual aspects.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification
  • Technical explanation
  • Exploratory

Main Points Raised

  • One participant seeks to understand the physical representation of divergence, suggesting it can be thought of as "flux per volume."
  • Another participant asserts that divergence indicates where flux lines end.
  • A participant confirms the idea of divergence as "flux per volume" and provides a mathematical limit definition involving flux across a surface.
  • Further clarification is provided that divergence can be expressed as the ratio of total flux to volume, linking it to the divergence theorem.
  • Another participant states that divergence is flux density, which can vary in different vector fields, and explains how to calculate total flux through a solid.
  • A participant questions the practical usefulness of knowing divergence and requests a conceptual explanation of curl.
  • One participant explains that in fluid dynamics, divergence indicates sources or sinks of fluid, while curl represents the rotation of the fluid, using the analogy of a pinwheel to illustrate the concept.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the interpretations of divergence and curl, although there are varying levels of detail and emphasis in their explanations. The discussion remains exploratory without a definitive consensus on all aspects.

Contextual Notes

Some participants reference mathematical definitions and theorems, but the discussion does not resolve all assumptions or implications of these concepts.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be useful for students and professionals interested in vector calculus, fluid dynamics, and the applications of divergence and curl in physics and engineering contexts.

Nick R
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Hello I am trying to get my head around what the divergence actually represents physically.

If you have some vector field v, and the components of v, vx, vy, vz have dimensions of kg/s ("flow" - mass of material per second) the divergence will have units of kg/(s*m) (mass per time distance)

Say the divergence of v is constant in some region R with volume a.

div(v)*a has units (kg*m^2)/s (mass area per time) - this is the flux of v through area(R)

(div(v)*a)/area(R) has units (mass per time) - the net mass flowing out of R in some time

So what exactly is divergence - kg/(s*m)

Would it be accurate to think of the divergence as "Flux per volume" in general?
 
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its where the flux lines end
 
Nick R said:
Would it be accurate to think of the divergence as "Flux per volume" in general?

Exactly.

Take some small volume V. Let \Phi be defined as the flux of a vector field u out of the volume V. That is, if S is the closed surface bounding V, then \Phi is the flux across S, in the outward direction. Then the divergence is given by the limit

\mathrm{div} \vec u = \lim_{V \rightarrow 0} \frac{\Phi}{V}
 
exactly. Or to be more explicit on the above result,
\mathrm{div}\vec{u} = \frac{\oint_{S} \vec{u}\cdot \vec{dS}}{V}.
In fact we can derive this using the mean value theorem on integrals on the divergence theorem. :smile:
 
Divergence is simply flux density, flux per volume. In different vector fields the flux density can vary at different points in space. If you add all of the fluxes/volume up and multiply by volume then you will get the total flux through the solid.
 
What is the usefulness in knowing the Divergence of a vector field? I mean I realize it is important with regards to stuff like Maxwells equations. But I only learned those in Integral Form, and not differential form.

Also can someone conceptually explain what the Curl represents?
 
It's easiest to think of what these operators mean in a fluid.

The divergence in a fluid represents a source or a sink; if there is a point in space where the divergence is nonzero, then at that point, there is fluid being created or destroyed.

The curl represents the rotation of the fluid (imagine eddies of swirling water here). If you could put a little pinwheel in the fluid, the curl gives the rate at which the pinwheel would rotate, and the axis around which that rotation occurs.
 

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